NES/IOT Merger Poll

[KaiserElectric]

I thought the tags were amusing. I can understand why that sort of language would be offensive or hurtful to some people, but as someone who was "targeted" by the tags, I was not offended in the slightest.

If this shows up in more of our games, you're more then welcome to bring that up as a problem with our community. Until then, please don't pass judgement on us based on the barely offensive actions of just one user.

 

[Defacto]

If I'm correct it's a "inside joke" that started in valiant nation.

And I agree with NC.

The joke started in iotchat, right?

 

[gay_Aleks]

Is this really the time and place for this? I mean, I swear to God. This conversation has went through merger-PDMA-squabbling between NES and IOT-and now to bloody sexual orientation?

This is a debacle.

 

[NinjaCow64]

(Sorry if I forgot some people)

Cishets:
Lec
Reus
Sam
Mosh
Red
Tyo
Tolni

LGBT
Megs
Terran
Ninja
SK
Joan
Tallies
Calgoni

Waifuists:
Mech

6-7-1, LGBT wins.

You forgot HJ and Tani on the LGBT side, plus a whole bunch of cishets* who never go on chat/rarely go on chat and a few chat regulars (Thor for example). But we're getting a little off topic here.

*I'm not meaning this is a derogatory way, I know some parts of the internet use it as such, but I'm not.

 

[thomas.berubeg]

So. You go into our chat, you say ya wanna be with us.

Now you decide to insult us?

Completely missing the point.

Also, I want to make one final point. A lot of IOTers are juvenile. I don't mean that in a pejorative way; I'm talking about the community demographics. The average age of the IOTer is most likely high school aged, or early college.

The average age of the NESer, as Owen already indicated in his extremely thorough posts in the PDMA thread, is late college/early graduate school, though we have several individuals (like Masada and The_Strategos) with doctorates. Why does this make a difference?

High schoolers pull this kind of crap:

Spoiler Homophobic Language in IOT :

I have NEVER seen anything like this in the NES forum.

I'm sorry, but I don't want that kind of childish tagging going on in my NES forum. It's fine if they want to goof off with little insults like that in their forum, it's a high school-aged thing to do. But honestly, it doesn't fit with the NES forum, and the fact that they do it kind of bothers me.

I have a feeling it would bother others, too. I'm kind of not okay with childishly calling people "gay," at least not in a public forum, because I think I've outgrown that sort of behavior. I'm personally Catholic, but I feel uncomfortable at the thought of using homosexuality as a slur, especially since several NESers past and present are homosexual. I'd prefer to let those sorts of people have their own forum, honestly.

And this isn't the first extremely childish IOT outburst I've seen in the past week. It's extremely disheartening to me, since I seriously considered the prospect of unifying the two forums. I like a lot of IOTers who I have met. But dealing with this kind of childishness on a daily or weekly basis would be infuriating to me. I just can't countenance becoming one forum with people who do this kind of thing.

In the closing moments of this poll, I sincerely entreat the mods to not merge the forums. I am aware merging has a majority in the current polls, but frankly, I don't think a mature community and an immature community should currently be forced together in this way. It's not going to lead to anything good.

I urge NESers who have voted yes to change their votes to no.

I am also really dissapointed in this, too, and in most of the answering post, who seem to completely miss the problem. It's honestly pretty unacceptable, no matter what the intent was, the sexual identity of the "target," or the history behind prior interactions here.

I very much consider myself a part of both the IOT and NES communities, and have friends on both sides of the aisle (And I still don't believe that there should be sides to an aisle.) In my life, were any of my friends to use the word gay as an adjective in even a joking manner, there would be problems. I've known and been very close friends with people who have been heavily stigmatized and bullied for being part of LGBTQA+ community, who have been ostracized for who they are as people, and using that as a joke makes light of the struggle, EVEN IF IT"S A JOKE MADE BY SOMEONE GAY. In fact, I find it kind of surprising that that happened, because, even in Montreal, as liberal and open as liberal and open can be in our modern world, using the word gay as that kind of joke would have been night unthinkable.

In fact, I think the last time I've heard the word gay used in any kind of non-serious context was high school, and I grew up in the hillbilly areas of New Jersey, the reaches of Pennsyltucky, redneckia to the extreme.

 

[gay_Aleks]

Completely missing the point.

I was taken by emotions. I apologize. I have also edited my posts.. although the point still stands.

 

[Thlayli]

I'm hyper-sensitive to the issue because I've personally lost a close RL friend to suicide who was bullied and taunted mercilessly because of her sexual identity. I've never had to reveal that on CFC, but now I apparently do.

It's just not okay, and the responses to it EXCUSING IT are even worse.

 

[Mosher]

I'm hyper-sensitive to the issue because I've personally lost a close RL friend to suicide who was bullied and taunted mercilessly because of her sexual identity. I've never had to reveal that on CFC, but now I apparently do.

It's just not okay, and the responses to it EXCUSING IT are even worse.

Mate, that's not bullying, it's playful ribbing.

 

[Tyo]

Against my better judgement I again find myself posting about something I don't want to post about.

Alas.

While the whole thing is a specific inside joke I'm not personally aware of, yes it is inappropriate. It doesnt belong within the context of these forums.

However, I don't think intent is out of the question when talking about the context of this thing. It's a joke made among a small group of friends and should not by any means be grounds to say "IOT is full of immature prepubescents" which is the exact feeling I get from this sudden outcry about a couple tags in one game. IOT has been told multiple times to look past Lucky's rough exterior and see that he's a good guy. It feels grossly hypocritical to judge all of IOT based off such an offhand and out-of-the-way remark.

Again, that said, it should be taken out if possible.

 

[Thlayli]

Mate, that's not bullying, it's playful ribbing.

Yeah, and I think that's the difference here. You folks see it as okay, and thomas and I don't.

That's totally fine if you want to do that, but I'm just not comfortable with it in my subforum so maybe it's for the best if you keep it in yours.

 

[thomas.berubeg]

However, I don't think intent is out of the question when talking about the context of this thing. It's a joke made among a small group of friends and should not by any means be grounds to say "IOT is full of immature prepubescents" which is the exact feeling I get from this sudden outcry about a couple tags in one game. IOT has been told multiple times to look past Lucky's rough exterior and see that he's a good guy. It feels grossly hypocritical to judge all of IOT based off such an offhand and out-of-the-way remark.

I agree with this, and I'm not judging IOT on this at all. Like I said, you are my friends, just as Nesers almost all are.

 

[NinjaCow64]

I'm hyper-sensitive to the issue because I've personally lost a close RL friend to suicide who was bullied and taunted mercilessly because of her sexual identity. I've never had to reveal that on CFC, but now I apparently do.

It's just not okay, and the responses to it EXCUSING IT are even worse.

Jesus Christ I am sorry to hear about that.

I think that SK did the wrong thing yeah, I was mainly trying to provide context.

 

[NinjaCow64]

Mate, that's not bullying, it's playful ribbing.

Out of context it is impossible to tell that though.

 

[thomas.berubeg]

Out of context it is impossible to tell that though.

Absolutly.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Moderator Action: Thanks for that detour into the sexual politics of IOT, but let's not continue down that path.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

issues re: offensive tags

As with any offensive post, avatar, sig, usertitle, or location, it's best to report it to the staff. Explain why you consider it offensive, and let them deal with it.

 

[Thlayli]

You're right. There isn't a report button for tags, and I don't like to involve the mods if not necessary, but BJ is aware of the problem so I guess that's enough.

Jesus Christ I am sorry to hear about that.

I think that SK did the wrong thing yeah, I was mainly trying to provide context.

Thanks. I don't think all IOTers are immature. Many of them are awesome. I'm just pretty hurt because that kind of language can be used in a really bad way, and has been to people I cared about.

 

[Valka D'Ur]

You're right. There isn't a report button for tags, and I don't like to involve the mods if not necessary, but BJ is aware of the problem so I guess that's enough.

In a situation like this, I should think a PM to whoever moderates the forum where you see the tag (or whatever) should work.

 

[SouthernKing]

I apologize if it was offensive. It was the continuation of an ongoing chat inside joke and because I don't know how many people actually look at thread tags. In hindsight it was probably a bad idea and I'll gladly remove those thread tags.

As an aside I'm terribly sorry to hear that Thlayli, since as a witness of homophobic bullying I know how completely awful it is.

 

[Ailedhoo]

I guess it is a issue of context; the tags between may appear as simply fun to the group but to a person who wonders in...

Still the removal tags are a demonstration of the power of these diplomatic exchanges.

As a 23 year university international politics student in the last year of his degree I do confess to having a potential claim to a be a elder among the IOT. I also see a chance of guardianship, that NESIOT would encourage a talk among the age groups of users. Sone for instance is not in his 20s let but he does show a merit.

Unfortunately though I founded the use of abliest language from both communities. I will not name names but I remember a sad example of someone who said that keeping the community apart (in the old merger talks) was needed akin to "avoiding having a normal mix with a special needs figure." Abliest (and eugenic) attitudes have a danger we must prepare to deal with. Being inclusive may aid in this realm to help ensure a healthy merge.

Back to topic; I guess the fact we are talking of the issue shows merits to the merge as a means of both coming to terms.