Russian Answer to EU- The Eurasian Union

[warpus]

They are independant only when it suits them. Whenever there're talks about changing the price of gas to actual market price they quickly remind that we have "special ties". I have very little sympathy for Gazprom, but they actually (though surely unintentionally) help our reunification, because they say "either you're independant and pay market prices like everybody else, or, if you can't handle the actual price like a real counrty and need a discount because of some mythical brotherhood, about which you forget the next day, perhaps you're incapable to maintain a separate entity? Why don't we just unite and you'll have the gaz dirty cheep and lots of other candies." The only barrier is their ruling elites, who, like, wants to pretend that they run an independant country. People of Ukraine and Belarus would benefit enormously. They way they are now, they aren't any more democratic than Russia, so what's the difference?

But the fact that people freeze while they quarreling isn't cool, of course.

That's a totally separate issue from what we were discussing. I don't really know enough about it to comment.

 

[Veles]

I don't see how it's a separate issue. You're either a independent country, that plays by the rules of the market, or a leech, begging about a discount, trying to play independent to EU, and giving Russians a finger.

Talking about the leadership, not the people, obviously.

 

[Yeekim]

and I don't want any of this Putinesque cult of personality.

God, you´ve made me imagine pictures of Merkel hunting tigers while topless.

Now I need therapy.

 

[Leoreth]

I can't see how a convergence with Russian political culture could benefit us, unless it's a one way street in our direction. I certainly don't want Germany to become more nationalistic, more authoritarian and more corrupt, and I don't want any of this Putinesque cult of personality.

And that's only the tip of the iceberg.

 

[warpus]

I don't see how it's a separate issue. You're either a independent country, that plays by the rules of the market, or a leech, begging about a discount, trying to play independent to EU, and giving Russians a finger.

Talking about the leadership, not the people, obviously.

The market and the state are separate. I guess in Russia's and America's case this isn't true, but it's supposed to be.

 

[red_elk]

God, you´ve made me imagine pictures of Merkel hunting tigers while topless.

Now I need therapy.

Spoiler :

"After meeting with Vladimir Putin, the tigress gave birth to three cubs"

 

[Yeekim]

"After meeting with Vladimir Putin, the tigress gave birth to three cubs"

Too bad he couldn't visit that poor Javan Rhinoceros in time.

 

[Dachs]

Some lolstorians they must be then. Lev Gumiliov was a big fan of Great Steppe, but, seriousely, I don't see how an average Russian can relate to his Eurasianism.

Russians are European, period.

Who cares about individual Russians? We're talking about states and their policies.

 

[onedreamer]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-15790452



Moderator Action: Article abridged- please see rule 6b of the OT additional rules.

Russia, or at least Putin, is looking to be very serious on controlling the post-Soviet bloc. Maybe the republics will continue exist on the map, but they would be surrendering any real autonomy they gained since the fall of the USSR with this proposal. Speaking of which, Putin's claims on not trying to recreate the USSR only means that communist ideology won't be readopted.

So, my question is this; how serious would a Russian EU be? Could there be conflict between the two over Ukraine and/or the Baltic republics? Has the first move for a global conflict been set, or am I being a massive fearmongerer right now?

Apart from the fact that Russia should have worked to join the EU instead, but until when Russians don't get rid of their lobbists starting from Putin I don't see it happening...
The former asian republics have no real economical autonomy. As for politics, they are all dictatorships or semi dictatorships, the countries started walking towards decadence in everything and especially in culture since the fall of the USSR and consequent kick out of Russians from their Republics.
This Union looks like a consortium of big and small Dictators and the lobbies behind them who use the Res Publica to perpetrate their own interests. Not MUCH different from the rest of the world, but somewhat worse and with no "style" whatsoever. Sad that it is happening in formerly communist countries.

About possible conflicts on certain countries, especially baltic ones, I don't see how this is going to happen, given that these are already in the EU and NATO and neither their govs nor their people have certainly any intention to go towards a union dominated by Russia, even if the EU would fall. More than a massive fearmonger you looked like a massive disinformer in this instance.

The market and the state are separate. I guess in Russia's and America's case this isn't true, but it's supposed to be.

Did you form this opinion after talking to Papadopoulos, Berlusconi, Zapatero or with the former Irish prime minister?

Seriously though - Russia needs to stop treating its neighbours with a post-imperial disdain, otherwise the situation will never improve.

Disdain and bias comes also (or should I say even more) from the other side actually, and you are a clear example.
In most former asian Republics Russians couldn't find a job after the fall of the USSR because they were discriminated. In Armenia and in other Caucasian Republics it was even worse, with Russian people killed just because they were Russians.

 

[Winner]

Disdain and bias comes also (or should I say even more) from the other side actually, and you are a clear example.

Czechia isn't a neighbour of Russia nor a former Soviet republic, and in any case being invaded by it kinda soured the relations for a couple generations, so shove the attitude.

 

[onedreamer]

Czechia isn't a neighbour of Russia nor a former Soviet republic, and in any case being invaded by it kinda soured the relations for a couple generations, so shove the attitude.

so you got all set up and somehow managed to claim that I am wrong when your bias is evident? And if you're trying to imply that Kazakhstan or Lithuania weren't invaded you're more than biased...

 

[Yeekim]

In Armenia and in other Caucasian Republics it was even worse, with Russian people killed just because they were Russians.

In Armenia?
Anyway, Caucasians are with some regularity being killed in Russia just for being Caucasians, so that goes both ways...

 

[onedreamer]

In Armenia?
Anyway, Caucasians are with some regularity being killed in Russia just for being Caucasians, so that goes both ways...

Yes in Armenia. I doubt Caucasians and especially Armenians are being regularly killed in Russia, by common people at least, but I'm not going to start a debate like this, since when I said that bias is more from the other side, the use of terms such as "also" and "more" implies that there must be "some" from the other side as well. (quote: Disdain and bias comes also (or should I say even more)).
But yeah I know, twisting other ones' words and thoughts in OT is a common practice and it's easier to impose your point rather than answer to what is actually written.

 

[Yeekim]

Yes in Armenia.

Care to provide any sources? That is completely honest question, btw. Armenians and Russians are both Orthodox. I have never heard of any anti-Russian pogroms in Armenia and couldn't find any sources either.

I doubt Caucasians and especially Armenians are being regularly killed in Russia, by common people at least.

Depends whether you call skinheads "common people".

 

[Winner]

so you got all set up and somehow managed to claim that I am wrong when your bias is evident? And if you're trying to imply that Kazakhstan or Lithuania weren't invaded you're more than biased...

My bias, even if it existed, wouldn't be relevant to the discussion.

Plus, Czechia could hardly look at Russia with any post-imperial disdain even if it tried very very hard.

 

[Lone Wolf]

Yeah, I am wondering about Armenia, too. I assume Onedreamer got confused re the Karabakh war, which saw episodes of Armenian army killing unarmed people of Azerbaijan. By "Caucasian republics" he probably means Chechnya (and Russian North Caucasus in general), where there had indeed been violence against Russians.

 

[Tani Coyote]

How are Russia, Belarus and Kazakhstan in terms of income distribution compared to eachother? I recall Russia’s big on oligarchs, and I imagine the other two are similar.

Well, being on an economically-similar footing there would be one advantage it has over the EU.

On the other hand, in absolute terms Russia dominates in a way that makes France and Germany’s first among equals position in Europe look benign.

I’m sure there’s some benefit to this, though, if they’re willing to essentially become Russian satellites.

 

[innonimatu]

I’m sure there’s some benefit to this, though, if they’re willing to essentially become Russian satellites.

You mean, just join the russian federation as a few more republics?

 

[Lone Wolf]

You mean, just join the russian federation as a few more republics?

This is too blatant. This just won't do.

 

[Veles]

Who cares about individual Russians? We're talking about states and their policies.

Everybody cares about individual Russians, it's the only thing that matters in the end

What features of the post-yoke Russia's policy resemble that of Mongols in particular? How can there be a comparision between them and a superstitiosely religious, agricultural, forest-living society. It was a millenia old war between the forest and the steppe, won by the former. The steppe way of life was slowly but steadily dissapearing ever since. None of Mongols philosophy or political doctrine had any impact on Russia whatsoever.

This theory is plain intellectual wankery, far-fetched and rather superficial, imo. But whatever, everybody's entitled to an opinion. After all, I can see where it may come from.