2020 US Election (Part One)

[Patine]

True. Everyone liked the benefits, but as usual USians want the benefits without paying for them.

"I'm not for cheaper health insurance. I'm not for guaranteed health insurance. I want universal healthcare. I'm not selling insurance."
-Former Congressman Dennis Kucinich

 

[Timsup2nothin]

"I'm not for cheaper health insurance. I'm not for guaranteed health insurance. I want universal healthcare. I'm not selling insurance."
-Former Congressman Dennis Kucinich

For "the government" to provide healthcare it has to purchase healthcare. USians invariably want their government to provide them with stuff, while they squeal like pigs about anything the government does in order to make it happen.

 

[Patine]

For "the government" to provide healthcare it has to purchase healthcare. USians invariably want their government to provide them with stuff, while they squeal like pigs about anything the government does in order to make it happen.

It's also amazing how many Republican voters (and even Democratic and Independent voters) actually believe the blatant and transparent hoodwink that the GOP are more "fiscally responsibly" as a party, but Republican Administrations have just as big of budgets and drive up just as big of debts - they're priorities are just different. How is it that old saw is still believed by so many, despite evidence to the contrary?

 

[Socrates99]

It's also amazing how many Republican voters (and even Democratic and Independent voters) actually believe the blatant and transparent hoodwink that the GOP are more "fiscally responsibly" as a party, but Republican Administrations have just as big of budgets and drive up just as big of debts - they're priorities are just different. How is it that old saw is still believed by so many, despite evidence to the contrary?

The only president to run a surplus in my lifetime was a Democrat. Republicans are often worse on debt than Democrats. Republicans voters who believe they're better are rubes, marks, victims of a long con.

 

[Patine]

The only president to run a surplus in my lifetime was a Democrat. Republicans are often worse on debt than Democrats. Republicans voters who believe they're better are rubes, marks, victims of a long con.

The only Canadian Prime Minister up here to run a surplus in my lifetime was a Liberal Party PM - Jean Chretien, whose tenure in office was very close to Clinton's (1993-2003 as opposed to 1993-2001), even though the same myth perpetuates among many here for Progressive Conservative Party and later Conservative Party of Canada Governments.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

The only president to run a surplus in my lifetime was a Democrat. Republicans are often worse on debt than Democrats. Republicans voters who believe they're better are rubes, marks, victims of a long con.

I hate to say it, but most Democrats believe it as well. Tell a Democrat that their party is the big spending party and they are more likely to try to defend the spending than they are to challenge the premise.

 

[Patine]

I hate to say it, but most Democrats believe it as well. Tell a Democrat that their party is the big spending party and they are more likely to try to defend the spending than they are to challenge the premise.

Reagan: "Let's win the Cold War by outspending the Soviet Union on defense. We'll worry about the awe-inspiring debt in someone else's administration, and probably when I'm dead."
Modern American Voters: "President Reagan was a true symbol of American Fiscal Conservativism and responsibility."

 

[Gorbles]

See this (Twitter link, video in Tweet) is exactly why I'm predisposed to rolling my eyes when people focus on Bernie's rhetoric or aggressive behaviour.

WATCH: "You’re full of sh*t," @JoeBiden tells a man who accused him of "actively trying to end our Second Amendment right."

"I support the Second Amendment," Biden adds while vising under-construction auto plant in Detroit. @CBSNews

 

[Kyriakos]

Biden asked if he would veto a Medicare for all bill. "I would veto anything that delays the security and the certainty of the healthcare being available now". So, he would veto the bill, just try to spin it as being a protective measure.
Not much protection for those millions of US citizens who have no medical covering.

 

[Takhisis]

I said actively make your life worse. Doing nothing isn't that he not actively making your life better.

Trump tried to actively make whatever you do have worse.

If Bernie wasn't so hardline or didn't have a heap of other unrealistic ideas maybe he could have gotten the mist important one (healthcare reform) over the line.

You do realize the hard left is actively driving voters to Biden and maybe Trump right?

I recommend that you read that book Lexicus posted about yesterday.

Reagan: "Let's win the Cold War by outspending the Soviet Union on defense. We'll worry about the awe-inspiring debt in someone else's administration, and probably when I'm dead."
Modern American Voters: "President Reagan was a true symbol of American Fiscal Conservativism and responsibility."

Why do you think Tim left the Republicans?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Biden asked if he would veto a Medicare for all bill. "I would veto anything that delays the security and the certainty of the healthcare being available now". So, he would veto the bill, just try to spin it as being a protective measure.
Not much protection for those millions of US citizens who have no medical covering.

LOL...so, you aren't even doing the editing to fake your points any more, you are letting fat-rat's-internet-chat podcasts do it for you?

 

[Estebonrober]

It's just funny because if Trump wins in 2020 Cloud will be complaining about that.

I'm guessing you will to but you come across as a bit less inflammatory.

At the worst Biden won't do much. Trump actively tried to dismantle the ACA. Big difference right?

If Biden wins the nomination trying to torpedo him is actively helping Trump. You may as well vote Trump at that point.

If Bernie supporters don't turn out for Biden and he loses in a close election guess who is getting the blame?

If you turn out and he loses anyway that's on Biden.

If you don't turnout and Biden wins anyway you get made to look really stupid.

This is what I mean by undermining your own cause. If you throw the election or are even percieved to your cause is wrecked. You can have a seat at the table or burn it down. You're not getting the table though unless Sanders turns it around.

this is a dumb take. The primary is still ongoing. Until it’s over it’s not wrong to point out his flaws as a candidate. Furthermore none of this is going to stop trump or help him. He is going to lay waste to Biden.

 

[Socrates99]

I've developed a massive pet peeve in recent years. People from countries with UHC buying into the notion that Bernie's plans are crazy. Not naming names but...WTH?

 

[Kyriakos]

LOL...so, you aren't even doing the editing to fake your points any more, you are letting fat-rat's-internet-chat podcasts do it for you?

That's a charming comment. I am sure it is cool for you to call him "fat rat". That said, the issue isn't him, but what Biden himself said, namely that he would veto any medicare for all bill.
I know some here will still vote for him, and never let yourself think I would aspire to change those people's views - I am not god

 

[Timsup2nothin]

That's a charming comment. I am sure it is cool for you to call him "fat rat". That said, the issue isn't him, but what Biden himself said, namely that he would veto any medicare for all bill.
I know some here will still vote for him, and never let yourself think I would aspire to change those people's views - I am not god

Fat was inappropriate. LYING RAT seems like a really good fit though.

For the record "Biden said he would veto any medicare for all bill" is just another of Kyr's bald faced outrageous lies. The kind that for some reason he apparently thinks he should be allowed to tell with impunity. Personally, he is beginning to make me question whether the amusement he provides is worth the skin.

 

[Kyriakos]

Fat was inappropriate. LYING RAT seems like a really good fit though.

For the record "Biden said he would veto any medicare for all bill" is just another of Kyr's bald faced outrageous lies. The kind that for some reason he apparently thinks he should be allowed to tell with impunity. Personally, he is beginning to make me question whether the amusement he provides is worth the skin.

I posted a video where he literally says he would veto any medicate for all bill. Not sure what your own issue with replying to what Biden said is, but it is pretty tiresome to act as you do.
Biden claims he'd veto it to protect the healthcare you already have, to which it can be noted that millions in the Us do not have any healthcare.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I posted a video where he literally says he would veto any medicate for all bill.

No, he doesn't. You are posting lies, again. Or are you genuinely such a sad sack translator that you really believe that is what was said?

 

[Gorbles]

It would be interesting if anyone had a transcript of the interview so we could definitively settle what was actually said. I've found one online, but struggling to find the transcription source, so in the interest in good faith debate I'd rather not link it (even though I trust the account emphatically). Googling isn't turning up much, and neither is O'Donnell's social media.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

It would be interesting if anyone had a transcript of the interview so we could definitively settle what was actually said. I've found one online, but struggling to find the transcription source, so in the interest in good faith debate I'd rather not link it (even though I trust the account emphatically). Googling isn't turning up much, and neither is O'Donnell's social media.

What was said is that if a bill labeled "medicare for all" was presented and it was clearly not thought out and would leave people without healthcare he wouldn't sign it. People are genuinely afraid that Sanders hasn't thought through any sort of plan for accomplishing his "medicare for all" so allaying their fears gets votes. It's pretty simple politics.

"He said he would veto any medicare for all" is a bald faced lie.

 

[Ironsided]

9:40 into this one is the question and answer.