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83% of US doctors considering quitting because of Obamacare

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Dreadnought, Jul 9, 2012.

  1. LucyDuke

    LucyDuke staring at the clock

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    :rotfl:

    :rotfl:

    Can't even get past the thread title before...

    :rotfl:

    :rotfl:

    ...oh god wait you actually believe that title?

    :hide:

    BEAR RUN AWAY

    Really the mental gymnastics required to turn that premise into something that begins to make sense is astonishing. Color me impressed.
     
  2. BvBPL

    BvBPL Pour Decision Maker

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    Having a 4.7% response rate for an unsolicited survey of this nature isn’t bad. In fact, it can be quite a good number in some cases. That said, there are a number of flaws in this survey that invalidate it, especially compared with the 2008 Health Tracking Physician Survey.

    For one, the demographics are not representative of the US population of doctors. 80% of respondents say they belong to a single doctor or small practice, however upwards of 50% of medical practices are now in hospital or other large practices and only one third are in single doctor or small practices and another 15% were in 3-5 member group practices. In addition, the years in practice are not representative of the general physician population; in this study only 8.3% of respondents were in practice less than 10 years whereas 29.3% of US physicians report this level of seniority.

    The survey’s questions are completely loaded. The first question is “How do current changes in the medical system affect your desire to practice medicine?” which might be a valid question, however the only responses are “I’m re-energized,” “I’m thinking about quitting,” and “no opinion.” Where’s the option for folks who are half-heartedly going along with it? There’s a huge gulf between being re-energized and thinking about quitting that isn’t reflected on the survey. While the survey reports that 82% of docs are thinking about quitting, it doesn’t provide any explanation for why that is when the 2008 study showed 43% of physicians where somewhat satisfied with their careers and 39% were very satisfied. Can we really assume that all of those doctors are now thinking about quitting when the majority of the ACA reforms haven’t even come into effect yet?

    The findings of the survey are equally spurious. The survey’s authors highlight that two thirds of the respondents report “just squeaking by or in the red” in terms of their practices’ finances. First off, we have to question whether the ~20% of respondents who are part of large practices are even in a position to know how well their practices are doing. Secondly, an examination of the actual question shows that 32.5% of respondents say their practice is “in the black” full stop, 37.3% that their practice is “in the black, but just squeaking by,” 12.3% are “breaking even” and only 14.5% report that they are in the red. That may seem a little damning, but that doesn’t mean that doctors themselves are going broke. It is the responsibility of a practice, even a single-doctor private one, to pay out doctors’ salaries, so any practice that is in the black, squeaking by, or breaking even is still paying its doctors with no significant problem. Suggesting that two thirds of the doctors are squeaking by or worse ignores the fact that ~70% are operating in the black. Similar chicanery of findings is used on other issues as well.

    In short, this survey isn’t worth the paper it was printed on.


    If you have any concerns about becoming a doctor then don't do it. Apart from national Romney-care, medicare issues, and all that national stuff, the training, education, and personal investment required to become a doctor is so significantly high that it is not worth doing unless you are wholly committed to medicine. Being a doctor isn't just a job, it is a vocation and if you aren't feeling the call then don't bother.
     
  3. Dachs

    Dachs Hero of the Soviet Union

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    The OP has practice; he is a traitor, after all.
     
  4. Formaldehyde

    Formaldehyde Both Fair And Balanced

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    So they are going to go back to college to learn a new profession because they hate Obamacare so much?


    I just wonder how many receptionists are now giggling hysterically.
     
  5. History_Buff

    History_Buff Knight of Cydonia

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    Yeah, if you actually read the survey responses, the only impression you can get is these are people who are generally dissatisfied with their jobs. They seem to hate everything about it, which has little if anything to do with Obama and the ACA.
     
  6. Askthepizzaguy

    Askthepizzaguy Know the Dark Side

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    This thread.... mmmm. So delicious.


    If I were to encapsulate the entire spirit of Off-Topic in one thread, this would be the thread. Something stunningly absurd, and then grabbing some popcorn so I can watch other folks (Form, for example) use logic against it. Always a one-sided match.

    :popcorn: OM NOM NOM NOM NOM
     
  7. Antilogic

    Antilogic --

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    You stole my post. :D
     
  8. Turquoiside

    Turquoiside Emperor

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    In a "Fair and Balanced' vein of thought, sure.
     
  9. useless

    useless Social Justice Rogue

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    A worthless study that tell us nothing. For shame, Op.
     
  10. BvBPL

    BvBPL Pour Decision Maker

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    It is perfectly possible to develop a meaningful survey that provides representative results from a very narrow number of respondents. However, that assumes that the research instrument itself is valid and that the methodology is sound. This research instrument is completely invalid, and I have doubts about the methodology as well.
     
  11. Turquoiside

    Turquoiside Emperor

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    No it's not possible for a Tea Party affiliate to produce reasonable results from a fraction of a fraction of the people they contacted. After that statistical wall you posted earlier, I really shouldn't have to explain that the only people who would follow with this process, which involved contacting te group multiple times, are those with strong opinions about the issue.
     
  12. Glassfan

    Glassfan Mostly harmless

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    Demand increases, but the ability to charge fair price doesn't. Government insurance pays out the lowest return of any insurance program. Many have criticised current government Medicare as "deadbeat" - sometimes it doesn't pay at all.

    Doctors will indeed work harder, especially if those statistics about future medical professional shortages are true. But these doctors will not be able to set their own prices, Obamacare will decide embursement, and it will be bargain-basement.

    Where I work, the hospital is delighted, it means more customers and business for the corporation; but the doctors are not - more work but diminishing returns. Doctors already face sky-high malpractice insurance premiums, and now the payment they recieve from Obamacare patients will be the lowest, which will drive the private insurance industry to lower their payments as well to remain competative.

    It's perhaps too early to tell how it's all going to work out. Canadian doctors make about the same as US counterparts, but only because their malpractice insurance is so much lower there.
     
  13. ParkCungHee

    ParkCungHee Deity

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    He's the real question: What do 83% of doctors imagine they'll do after quitting?
     
  14. Ailedhoo

    Ailedhoo wonderer

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    It... is insane claiment. 83%? Realy? How many doctors where interviewed? Were they selected to be interviewed for their conclustive views by any chance? How made up was the study?

    Lies, dame lies and statistics.
     
  15. Glassfan

    Glassfan Mostly harmless

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    That's a good point. We often hear our doctors say things like this whenever there's a big increase in malpractice premiums. It's their frustration speaking.

    The AMA was a supporter of Obamacare, but they now only have 17% of American doctors as members. Doctors, according to several polls, are strongly against it. Hospitals are the big winners, and it's probably truer to say the AMA represents hospitals more than doctors these days.
     
  16. mangxema

    mangxema I

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    I think he's talking more about the new doctors who may decide to go into another profession rather than go to medical school.
     
  17. Cutlass

    Cutlass The Man Who Wasn't There.

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    And yet there still is not a news report on this "study". So why are people being even this kind to the OP?



    This thread is the number one Google hit on the subject. And the other hits are other forum, mostly right leaning, or rightwing blogs. No news service appears to have picked up the story.
     
  18. Arakhor

    Arakhor Dremora Courtier Moderator

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    That's presumably because "3.57% of doctors..." doesn't make for a compelling headline.
     
  19. BvBPL

    BvBPL Pour Decision Maker

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    Yes, medicare patients represent the a very low reimbursement rate. Maybe even the lowest rate except for the patients that the doctors will treat for free. This study showed that 52% of respondents would rather treat a medicare patient for free than file the paperwork. So I guess if you don't want to pay for medicine, find a doctor who is thinking about quitting and tell them you have medicare. You've got an even chance of getting free healthcare! How's that for lowering health care costs, Mr. Obama?

    Interestingly, that figure of 52% is in-line with the 2008 survey question about doctors giving special consideration to charity cases.



    We're Number One!
     
  20. kochman

    kochman Deity

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    Would be if there are no price caps... but, I'm sure there will be, will there not?

    The only good thing, just about, with private medicine... doctors make more money, and so there is the incentive to study hard and take on all the debt of being in med school, etc.
     

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