Dawn of Civilization - an RFC modmod by Leoreth

[iOnlySignIn]

No, it's Vanuatu. Sorry for spoiling the surprise

A worthy and long expected choice.

It's my home country according to most of my internet accounts. Although CivFanatics is rather lenient so I can just put in "Virgo Supercluster" instead.

 

[Leoreth]

What a coincidence! I live in the Virgo Supercluster as well!

 

[BenZL43]

Ah, not Tibet? --"

 

[Lone Wolf]

Sure, although part of their purpose is to hurt super-Spain so there needs to be a balance.

Okay, I am going to the Python files and removing every Spain nerf I can find (like 4 colonists istead of six). I like dominant AI's. (And Spain usually lagged behind in tech in my games anyway. But then, I usually improved the English and German AI performance, but left Spanish AI's almost untouched).

 

[Leoreth]

I'm currently committing the new civilizations (they're just in the game files / civilopedia now, not in the actual game).

My original four civs were:

Moors
Poland
Tamils
Tibet

But when reading the speculation here I decided that the Harappans and Kongolese were also rather nice additions.

 

[hoplitejoe]

I am interested in how you will deal with the downfall of the Harappans.

 

[Leoreth]

I'm interested in that too

 

[iOnlySignIn]

I am interested in how you will deal with the downfall of the Harappans.

I'm interested in that too

Easy way to be historically realistic:

Start the game (3000BC) with their core loaded with Flood Plains (ala Egypt and Mesopotamia). Then, starting around 1800BC, they gradually turn into Swamps.

That and some Barbs coming from the Iranian plateau would do it.

 

[hoplitejoe]

One other thing, as we are widening the way we define a civ that makes sense to represent, how long till we see natives in the USA and Canada?

edit:the Aryan invasion is no longer thought as the way the Indus Valley civ ended.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

I just updated. The Tibetan UU looks as overpowered as hell. I hope they'd be able to take AI China's capital, at least temporarily.

Tibetan UP: The Power of Spirituality: 1 Free Priest per Temple and Priests provide an extra +2 and +1 .

The Moorish UU/UB also look great. Can't wait to play it to stomp Spain.

The Chola UU/UB look underwhelming. Hope they have an awesome UP. +0.5 per Water Tile would be great.

edit:the Aryan invasion is no longer thought as the way the Indus Valley civ ended.

Yeah it's climate change (Monsoon shift) mostly.

In DoC, that translates to Swamps.

 

[Hippo8085]

I hope they'd be able to take AI China's capital, at least temporarily.

Well at least 15 days, if you trust Wikipedia. Perhaps that could be a UHV
Would be needing more resources in Tibet, make a civilization sustainable and give horses, though that is implied.

Iberia would need to change dramatically. Which tile might Qurtubah be on and how to make it not an easy decision raze for the Spanish player despite the wonders. Maybe make it like the Angkor/Ayutthaya exchange.

 

[Linkman226]

Qurtuba is Cordoba. That tile already exists.

 

[Moshe Dayan]

So what's going to happen to "India"? Are they just going to exist alongside the Harappans, Tamils, Mughals, and the trading company civs (although probably not at the same time, obviously)? Wouldn't it make more sense to rename the Indian civ the "Mauryans" or something along those lines? After all, they clearly no longer represent all of India.

 

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

Well at least 15 days, if you trust Wikipedia. Perhaps that could be a UHV
Would be needing more resources in Tibet, make a civilization sustainable and give horses, though that is implied.

Iberia would need to change dramatically. Which tile might Qurtubah be on and how to make it not an easy decision raze for the Spanish player despite the wonders. Maybe make it like the Angkor/Ayutthaya exchange.

Tibet in real life is very resource poor. Many parts of Tibet outside of Lhasa and the larger towns have poor access to electricity (depending on portable generators/other methods).
A lot of resources come in from either China proper, Xinjiang or Pakistan (via the Karakorum Highway).
But I think there is some real potential there to have high production + military from their strategic location.
I would suggest a UP that helps them get food for spreading Buddhism actually.
Also, if they are going to be included, then I think bringing back some yellow for China in Tibet is order,
and vice-versa for the region around the old Tang capital (Chang'an) for Tibet.

 

[iOnlySignIn]

I would suggest a UP that helps them get food for spreading Buddhism.

Then the Khmer UHV needs to be adjusted. There shouldn't be one civ designed to help another's UHV.

The current Tibet on the map is actually quite powerful already in terms of . What it lacks is . If you play as China, with a late game Cereal Industry and a fully Windmilled Tibet, Lhasa will be your No. 3 or No. 4 city.

Which is why Tibet's UB/UP should give it or Free Specialists. But such a UB/UP can be easily abused if Tibet actually does take over some of China's core cities so it needs to be limited, perhaps to the capital city.

 

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

Then the Khmer UHV needs to be adjusted. There shouldn't be one civ designed to help another's UHV.

I agree. The Khmer really should be a teeny bit more Hindu anyway.

 

[J. pride]

Easy way to be historically realistic:

Start the game (3000BC) with their core loaded with Flood Plains (ala Egypt and Mesopotamia). Then, starting around 1800BC, they gradually turn into Swamps.

That and some Barbs coming from the Iranian plateau would do it.

Am I the only one that doesn't see the purpose in this? So what is the point of a civilization which is just there to occupy space without any other purpose especially since they are suppose to be destroyed well before "real" interaction between civilizations can occur. The Moors, the Tamils, the Polish civilizations at one time were a significant power that interacted with other empires, declared war, peace etc. The only real impact of the Harappan Civilization is indirect. Its much like Judaism, it (might have) influenced Vedic Culture and Indian Civilization but you can't even be sure of that. I guess what Im trying to say is there is no tangible effect of the Harappans on the world. (No cities, no language, no famous conquests...). It is theorized (or speculated) that people that inhabited the Indus back then might be the South Indians of today because of some sort of massive migration due to desertification which means that the Pakistanis of today are a completely different people.

 

[ozqar]

Hey! I think it's totally awesome that you included this civs! I'm super excited about Tibet, and will try the other ones as well. I just have a question... I just SVN'd my folder, but can't see any of them in the civ choice list. Are they supposed to be there? Or how do I play with them?

 

[iOnlySignIn]

Am I the only one that doesn't see the purpose in this? So what is the point of a civilization which is just there to occupy space without any other purpose especially since they are suppose to be destroyed well before "real" interaction between civilizations can occur. The Moors, the Tamils, the Polish civilizations at one time were a significant power that interacted with other empires, declared war, peace etc. The only real impact of the Harappan Civilization is indirect. Its much like Judaism, it (might have) influenced Vedic Culture and Indian Civilization but you can't even be sure of that. I guess what Im trying to say is there is no tangible effect of the Harappans on the world. (No cities, no language, no famous conquests...). It is theorized (or speculated) that people that inhabited the Indus back then might be the South Indians of today because of some sort of massive migration due to desertification which means that the Pakistanis of today are a completely different people.

Do you ever play as Maya? Or Aztec/Inca? 90% of the time these civs either die without contacting another civ or die to the first civ they come into contact with.

Harappans can be much more interesting than those three because of its location in the center of Eurasia with potential for both eastward and westward interactions. They can migrate to the Ganges valley and defeat/prevent the Vedic India from spawning. The can expand toward the Persian Gulf/Transoxiana to compete with the Persians.

And you're wrong about the lack of historical interactions. Harappans/IVC traded extensively with Mesopotamia and Egypt. Artifacts originated in those areas (as evidenced by their style and make) have been unearthed in IVC ruins.

 

[Tomorrow's Dawn]

I am actually quite glad that my Kongolese suggestion is being seriously taken into consideration, by the way.

I don't know about everyone else, but in the absence of being able to chop jungles with Iron Working,
I feel like there should be one group that can at least take advantage of them early on.
And that part of Africa is always notoriously empty save for the odd conquerors of Mbanza Kongo.