Russia a democracy after all - sort of

[Winner]

At least the ruling duo finds it funny:

 

[Aleksey_aka_al]

You are biased biaser.

 

[Terxpahseyton]

Funny how "the west" (i.e., the USA) had no problem with financing and supporting Yeltsin several manipulations of russian elections, not even Putin's first, and now cries wolf...

I would find it even more funny if you gave a source.

 

[red_elk]

"Propaganda" doesn't equal to "misleading, scandalous headlines with an aim to increase sales no matter what". That is called yellow press. At least that is how I understand it.

What about CNN headline "Russia attacks Georgia" with picture of Georgian MRLs firing at Tskhinvali in the background?
Victims of Putin's bombing in Gori, with one "corpse" in clean clothes lying in different poses in multiple pictures?
What about Fox News shutting up Ossetian girl when she's trying to say that the Russians came to save them?
I can find pictures or video if anybody wants.

 

[Oruc]

What about CNN headline "Russia attacks Georgia" with picture of Georgian MRLs firing at Tskhinvali in the background?
Victims of Putin's bombing in Gori, with one "corpse" in clean clothes lying in different poses in multiple pictures?
What about Fox News shutting up Ossetian girl when she's trying to say that the Russians came to save them?
I can find pictures or video if anybody wants.

I would like to see them.

 

[red_elk]

I would like to see them.

First, CNN news. Georgian MRLs firing at Tskhinvali shown starting from 0.30.
Headline - "Russia invades Georgia"

Link to video.

Second - Reuters pictures.

1. Corpse and victim's alleged relative:

2. "Corpse" rotating

3. Grieving guy got changed and continues his performance.

Third - Fox news report (0:32 - "She was able to flee to Russia... flee to North" )


Link to video.

 

[Traitorfish]

Similarly, the photo The Falling Soldier was later found to have been staged, therefore the Spanish Civil War didn't really happen. Anyone who disagrees is just biased against the Spanish.

 

[red_elk]

Similarly, the photo The Falling Soldier was later found to have been staged, therefore the Spanish Civil War didn't really happen. Anyone who disagrees is just biased against the Spanish.

That would be relevant if I claimed that Russia never bombed Gori. Whether any civilian was killed, that is the question.

 

[Oruc]

First, CNN news. Georgian MRLs firing at Tskhinvali shown starting from 0.30.
Headline - "Russia invades Georgia"

Second - Reuters pictures.

1. Corpse and victim's alleged relative:

2. "Corpse" rotating

3. Grieving guy got changed and continues his performance.

Third - Fox news report (0:32 - "She was able to flee to Russia... flee to North" )

Good stuff red_elk, many people in the west don't realise what a distorted picture the media paints, alot of what that guy says in the first video can be applied to American foreign policy.

 

[Yeekim]

Umm...
1) The headline in the first news story is correct, isn't it?
And while they show bombing of Tshkinvali, they also speak about Georgian attempt to reclaim South Ossetia. They are showing what they are speaking about.
2) We don't know in what succession the pictures are taken, do we? The grieving guy is obviously the same person, he simply seems to have taken off his jacket and shirt. If the second and third photo are taken earlier, why would it be strange for him to have turned the corpse around?
3) They could both speak their mind and they got their message across quite clearly, didn't they?

If that is the best "anti-Russian propaganda" you have, color me unimpressed.

 

[innonimatu]

I would find it even more funny if you gave a source.

Feel free to track sources, starting here, for example. And I'm not even getting into the whole subject of Yeltsin's earlier coup in 1993, complete with bombardment of parliament, which opened the way for the pillaging of state property and the rise of the oligarchs, and which most media reports delete from russian history (now and then) almost as effectively as Stalin deleted people from pictures.

The acts of the paragon of democracy:

The praising of (and self-congratulating over) the paragon of democracy:

 

[red_elk]

Umm...
1) The headline in the first news story is correct, isn't it?

It's about as correct as headline "USSR invades Germany" would be correct in 1944.
They forgot to mention that invasion started after Georgia used MRLs attacking city and a base of Russian peacekeepers, killing civilians and soldiers.
If you didn't get a point yet - multiple rocket launchers is a weapon which is used to wipe out large areas. They clearly not intended to be used against small sized military facilities.
Exactly this moment of shelling is shown on the video, with remark at the bottom line "Russia invades Georgia". No, not a propaganda at all.

We don't know in what succession the pictures are taken, do we? The grieving guy is obviously the same person, he simply seems to have taken off his jacket and shirt. If the second and third photo are taken earlier, why would it be strange for him to have turned the corpse around?

They were shown in the same order as I placed them here. Also, IIRC, Reuters reporter confessed later that pictures were made up, because they arrived on site too late.

3) They could both speak their mind and they got their message across quite clearly, didn't they?

Isn't it clear that their message was surprise for spokesman? Of course he couldn't just shut them off, that would be too obvious - but they would not be allowed to say anything if he knew that beforehand.
That it was hard for him to explain why civilians flee not to Georgia, but to Russia, where cruel invaders came from? "Russia... erm. Nord."

If that is the best "anti-Russian propaganda" you have, color me unimpressed.

I bet you wouldn't be impressed even with Reagan and his "Empire of Evil" speech. This all was true, not propaganda!

 

[Yeekim]

Feel free to track sources, starting here, for example.

That article rings depressingly true.

 

[luiz]

I bet you wouldn't be impressed even with Reagan and his "Empire of Evil" speech. This all was true, not propaganda!

Political speech is not the same as a propaganda or disinformation campaign... it is a political speech. Jeez.

I think you should be more concerned about widespread reports of ballot boxes being rigged all accross Russia and percentages adding up to more than 100%, and less concerned with a supposed bias in western press against Russia. If anything Russia gets favourable treatment in the western press when compared to say Israel (was it Reuters or AP that admitted photoshopping a picture to make the effect of a israeli strike look more damaging than it was?).

 

[Aleksey_aka_al]

I think you should be more concerned about widespread reports of ballot boxes being rigged all accross Russia and percentages adding up to more than 100%, and less concerned with a supposed bias in western press against Russia

No. It is more important when and where it all started, and the answer is Yeltsin.

Similarly, the photo The Falling Soldier was later found to have been staged, therefore the Spanish Civil War didn't really happen.

Those were the proofs in the question whether there's propaganda or not, and not the question whether there was war or not.

 

[Terxpahseyton]

Great article innonimatu, thanks for sharing.

 

[Leoreth]

Political speech is not the same as a propaganda or disinformation campaign... it is a political speech. Jeez.

Was it? I think it was at least completely uncalled for and someone who brands a whole country as capital-E-Evil can't be out for a rational and fact based discussion.

I think you should be more concerned about widespread reports of ballot boxes being rigged all accross Russia and percentages adding up to more than 100%, and less concerned with a supposed bias in western press against Russia. If anything Russia gets favourable treatment in the western press when compared to say Israel (was it Reuters or AP that admitted photoshopping a picture to make the effect of a israeli strike look more damaging than it was?).

Also, last time I checked, TIME is part of Western press? Black sheep like Fox News will always produce nonsense, but it's the big picture that counts.

But it's become Russian habit to complain about past injustices and lost greatness rather than focusing on the problems at hand. And their government is good at abusing that.

 

[Aleksey_aka_al]

But it's become Russian habit to complain about past injustices and lost greatness rather than focusing on the problems at hand. And their government is good at abusing that.

Very natural to grow such a habbit when everyone around you have it, you know. Plus to the habbit of complaining about you regardless of anything.

And by "everyone" I mean a specific group you can't get away from: the West and its newer satellites.

 

[madviking]

NB: next post is best viewed in NOT in black CFC.

Statistical evidence of voter fraud.

From left to right the four curves represent Mexican legislative election 2009, second round of Polish presidential election in 2010, Bulgarian legislative election in 2009 and Swedish legislative election in 2010.

Now let's take a look if Russian elections in 2011 follow the same logic:

The pale brown curve is for the 2003 legislative election, the dark brown curve is for the 2007 legislative election, the light blue curve is for the 2004 presidential election and the dark blue curve is for the 2008 presidential election.

Picture on the left is about Russian legislative election 2007, the second picture is from Moscow city parliament election in 2009. Every dot represents the amount of votes that a party had at a polling station. The X-axis is for turnout of the polling station and the Y-axis is for the percentage of votes a party had at that station. Different colors represent different parties.
[Purple is UR]

The Y-axis is for the amount of polling stations, the X-axis is the vote percentage.
["EP" is UR]

This is a curve of United Russia votes in Magnitogorsk...

 

[aronnax]

Well the statistics are damning. Seems like voter fraud was there and seem parallel to Yelstin's election.