StarNES: Updates Without Number (Epoch I)

[nutranurse]

Considering the whole map will be filled to the brim with nebulae at this rate and it's really hard to get rid of them, perhaps the cost should be increased to 15 or 20.

There's no reason why the nebulae can't (eventually) condense into new star systems in further epochs. After all, it's not like In the Beginning, something created all the stars and that was that. Cosmology is an active process

I'll take these two points into consideration, however less usable stars = a wider scope for Epoch IV, so it's not necessarily a bad thing.

I might increase the nebulae cost to 15GC¤ while giving a (very slight) chance for nebula to form stars.

 

[spaceman98]

It's space, everything's relative.

Also, I made a mistake! This turn's gal-wonder will be named by spaceman98, as he made Taman, not Tecknojock (I was thinking of Falia's creator, which IS Tecknojock, when I wrote that footnote).

The Half-Stars of Taman (anyone have any better ideas?)

Also, I have been gathering money for a black hole for some time now. I would be willing to pool money for a black hole.

 

[Blaze Injun]

Hey,

Also, I have been gathering money for a black hole for some time now. I would be willing to pool money for a black hole.

Also no sharing GC¤. We are not communists.

Blaze Injun

 

[hbar]

Spoiler Cosmology :

Note: below has nothing to do with the NES.

Here, I personally think all of the galaxies orbit around one giant point. The big bang spreads them out in every direction including up and down. Eventually, the ones that stay in their normal orbit would hit again after several zillions of years due to the frictionless movement caused by the big bang. Essentially causing an endless loop of Big Bangs where new matter is formed each time.

Look at this theory of mine like this: 10 planes take off at the North pole and all go different directions((straight line no stops, same speed)). Eventually, they would crash into each other at the South Pole for some spectacular fireworks.

That's a common misconception. The assumption you're making is that spacetime already existed, it was just empty. But the thing is, the Big Bang made spacetime - it just wasn't there beforehand. So there is no 'central' point of the universe, much like there is no 'central' point on the surface of a balloon.

In fact, a balloon is a good metaphor for the universe. If you draw pictures of galaxies and stars on the surface of a balloon, and then inflate it, all of the objects will be moving away from all of the other objects. They will never collide, because at no point are they getting closer. If the balloon is stretchy enough, the stars will eventually be so far apart that everything else vanishes over the horizon. That's probably the ultimate (and depressing) fate of the universe.

That's not to say your theory is without merit. If spacetime is a more exotic shape than just a bubble or a saddle, then some cool stuff can happen. I personally think spacetime is a 4-D Klein Bottle, which I think would result in a Big Crunch (or, as you describe, a Big Jetliner Crash) even though the "balloon" keeps expanding. But at this point, I'm way out of my depth, and just speculating for the fun of it all.

 

[nutranurse]

Yep! hbar has nailed it on the head; my astrophysics prof explained the conception of the universe/how to visualize it to us in the exact same way.

 

[Gem Hound]

Spoiler Cosmology :

That's a common misconception. The assumption you're making is that spacetime already existed, it was just empty. But the thing is, the Big Bang made spacetime - it just wasn't there beforehand. So there is no 'central' point of the universe, much like there is no 'central' point on the surface of a balloon.

In fact, a balloon is a good metaphor for the universe. If you draw pictures of galaxies and stars on the surface of a balloon, and then inflate it, all of the objects will be moving away from all of the other objects. They will never collide, because at no point are they getting closer. If the balloon is stretchy enough, the stars will eventually be so far apart that everything else vanishes over the horizon. That's probably the ultimate (and depressing) fate of the universe.

That's not to say your theory is without merit. If spacetime is a more exotic shape than just a bubble or a saddle, then some cool stuff can happen. I personally think spacetime is a 4-D Klein Bottle, which I think would result in a Big Crunch (or, as you describe, a Big Jetliner Crash) even though the "balloon" keeps expanding. But at this point, I'm way out of my depth, and just speculating for the fun of it all.

I still think though that it could be possible. My idea also includes the balloon if you read it closely.

 

[Double A]

I'll take these two points into consideration, however less usable stars = a wider scope for Epoch IV, so it's not necessarily a bad thing.

I might increase the nebulae cost to 15GC¤ while giving a (very slight) chance for nebula to form stars.

What about aging them and/or the nebula that you want to form something needs to border at least 3 other nebulae. The more nebulae it touches, the better chance a star or planet will form and the bigger/awesomer it is.

 

[nutranurse]

Well the trouble with your balloon analogy, so far as my limited knowledge/grasp of astronomy allows me to analyze, is that the objects created via the big bang are moving across the space/time, when it seems to be space/time itself moves as well, causing the points/objects to go out further and further.

Having 10 planes move over the world/balloon/universe would see the universe be kind of closed, when I was taught that it was the opposite.


edit: Double A, yeah there would be a hidden stipulation that the nebula needs to be surrounded by other nebulae. However, I am very reluctant to put nebula→star into player hands and would rather reserve it as a kind of special random event.

 

[SouthernKing]

What you are talking about, Gem Hound, is the so-called "Big Crunch" theory, which, because of the strength of the force of gravity, the rate of universal expansion would slow, and in time, reverse, so that a reverse big bang (the Big Crunch) would occur, and there was the possibility of a cycle of big bangs and crunches. In the 1990s, this was the all but universally accepted theory.

Then came observations that the rate of expansion was not slowing down; it was in fact accelerating. This has been put down to "dark energy", a force that is not truly understood yet but is known to exist; alongside the similarly unknown dark matter, it binds all the objects of the universe together.

 

[Gem Hound]

Spoiler :

Well the trouble with your balloon analogy, so far as my limited knowledge/grasp of astronomy allows me to analyze, is that the objects created via the big bang are moving across the space/time, when it seems to be space/time itself moves as well, causing the points/objects to go out further and further.

Having 10 planes move over the world/balloon/universe would see the universe be kind of closed, when I was taught that it was the opposite.

That was only describing the part that would make the big bang. I also included the balloon analogy in my theory. There would be an infinitely large expanse for these derelict galaxies to expand in and slowly separate. According to my theory of how the big bang was created((current astronomy from what I know says this: "There was nothing, then BANG! There was something."))
What I'm proposing is that there was something that caused the big bang. Several galaxies smacking together. We would be in the derelict portion or the very beginning of my theory.

 

[SouthernKing]

SouthernKing: 58 GC
Bank 58 GC

 

[Gem Hound]

What you are talking about, Gem Hound, is the so-called "Big Crunch" theory, which, because of the strength of the force of gravity, the rate of universal expansion would slow, and in time, reverse, so that a reverse big bang (the Big Crunch) would occur, and there was the possibility of a cycle of big bangs and crunches. In the 1990s, this was the all but universally accepted theory.

Then came observations that the rate of expansion was not slowing down; it was in fact accelerating. This has been put down to "dark energy", a force that is not truly understood yet but is known to exist; alongside the similarly unknown dark matter, it binds all the objects of the universe together.

Never actually looked up this theory and came up with it off the top of my head. I feel like a fool now since I've never even heard of Dark Energy.

 

[SouthernKing]

Never actually looked up this theory and came up with it off the top of my head. I feel like a fool now since I've never even heard of Dark Energy.

Don't be. It's fairly recent, many people are actually skeptical about its very existance due to the lack of any information on it.

While you're there, this and this are the two most popular theories on the ultimate fate of the universe.

 

[nutranurse]

So I'm procrastinating and brainstorming some concepts about how to model players making their spacefaring races in Epoch II (when they get there). Really, this won't factor till the very tail end of Epoch II as it transitions into Epoch III.

How would you guys like to tackle FTL travel? I have several mechanics drafted up concerning this, but the two that I find most agreeable to me would be to either:

Allow players to choose from some basic building blocks (dark matter-verse; hyper-verse; farcasters/slingshots-verse; nothing-verse) and then extrapolate as they will. Mechanically they would function fairly similarly in Epoch III (x amount of hex movements for a fleet), but would alter the flavor of the developing space empires drastically.

When I say 'verse' I mean give players some way to make up FTL, such as a dark matter-verse based FTL involving the use of dark matter/travel across or through it; or a hyper-verse based FTL involving the use of a 'hyper' dimension that is like some sort of smaller, but parallel universe; or a slingshot-verse being a kind of 'fast' dimension created via FTL that generates incredibly high speeds; or a nothing-verse being, well, nothing and revolves around FTL that deals with temporarily making you not exist.

From there players would be able to just move along and do whatever with their spacefaring races, like SouthernKing making a race of space mongoose-mongols that travel on great organic ships that operate via a manipulation of dark matter in such a way that sees them coast along the rim of a parallel dark matter universe to achieve FTL, while theDright has a race of interstellar snake-slavers that travel on large, snake-like ships that achieves FTL by 'exciting' nearby dark matter in such a way that it propels their ships forward. Both SK & theDright in this case operate via Dark Matter, but they do so in their own ways.

The benefits of me giving a few building blocks would be that I can better create a sense of uniformity with fiction/lore; players are allowed to actually customize their spacefaring races; and a variety of ways to travel the sector to spice up the later epochs.

Downfalls include: me providing the foundations means I am limiting player creativity; e providing the foundations for FTL means I am making a lot of stuff up and may make some of you more astronomically inclined folks get a headache.

----

My other option would be to just have a generic "Yep, yall have space travel" and you guys can desire whatever the hell you want, but it is all represented via a uniform "2 hexes of movement per turn."

 

[thomas.berubeg]

I like the First Option, to be honest. and you seem to have it thought out much more completly.

 

[SouthernKing]

First, definitely

 

[hbar]

I'm partial to the second and fourth, personally. Dark matter is a little "MacGuffin"-esque for my taste. Though (if I understand you correctly) we get to choose from several technologies, so everyone wins!

 

[Eltain]

I vote first option, definitely.

 

[Terrance888]

44 GC
Large Terrestrial @ Titanotaur/15GC
2 Medium Terrestrials @ Lacuna/20Gc (Please be awesome,it's all shrouded in mists and everything!)
BANK: 9GC

 

[hbar]

I'm surprised you didn't include warp-verse, which is the only one with a currently completed schematic, obeying all known laws of physics.