Weed?

[Zardnaar]

What's the difference in using video games, or alcohol, or whatever? In terms of fun vs. boring, not necessarily health risks (which I'd agree with Samson is prolly actually lowest for weed, compared to some other things).

I don't smoke (or otherwise take) weed, (I do, in fact, play video games and drink alcohol), but I really don't see the difference. How people get their kicks, how people socialise, etc.

It's kind of artificial though. It's not just weed it's any drug.

If you need to use chemicals for fun you're kind of incapable of entertaining yourself otherwise. That's ignoring things like addiction etc.

To me it's a weakness, lack of self control, and a lack of imagination.

 

[Zardnaar]

Do you think that anyone who drinks is stupid?

Depends. I had two beers tonight.

I have it with a meal though and they don't really get me drunk.

So I don't do it for entertainment.

 

[Gorbles]

It's kind of artificial though. It's not just weed it's any drug.

If you need to use chemicals for fun you're kind of incapable of entertaining yourself otherwise. That's ignoring things like addiction etc.

To me it's a weakness, lack of self control, and a lack of imagination.

Alcohol by definition is also a drug. People have done studies on certain video games and how they've been designed, psychologically, to hook players. Addiction is a complicated thing that we shouldn't use to demonise something like weed over. People can get addicted to sugar. It's not just a drug thing (and most sugar products, are, generally, incredibly artificial in that they're not naturally-occurring foodstuffs).

 

[Zardnaar]

Alcohol by definition is also a drug. People have done studies on certain video games and how they've been designed, psychologically, to hook players. Addiction is a complicated thing that we shouldn't use to demonise something like weed over. People can get addicted to sugar. It's not just a drug thing (and most sugar products, are, generally, incredibly artificial in that they're not naturally-occurring foodstuffs).

Getting addicted to anything is foolish.

There's what you get addicted to though eg heroin vs pot vs Suger etc.

 

[Gorbles]

Getting addicted to anything is foolish.

There's what you get addicted to though eg heroin vs pot vs Suger etc.

Can't say I agree, but any discussion of addiction should prolly go in another thread. Don't want to hijack Narz's here.

 

[Samson]

Depends. I had two beers tonight.

I have it with a meal though and they don't really get me drunk.

So I don't do it for entertainment.

The logical steps I am examining are:

• Anyone who uses weed is stupid
• That is because weed is bad for you
• Alcohol is worse for you than weed
• Therefore anyone who uses alcohol is stupid

You get what I am saying? I am certainly not arguing against that all drugs come will significant downsides, but to say that anyone who uses them is inherently stupid seems unjustifiable to me. Especially when so much drug use can be seen as self medication for SLS (and I defiantly include alcohol in that).

 

[Farm Boy]

So, the answer is that it is more expensive to deal with the bureaucracy and a 15% tax than the drug war that the US spends billions or trillions on? I guess that makes sense, thanks for the insight. Though in this day and age I would not suggest a storefront. Online only is the way to reduce your overheads.

You wind up paying for both, this isn't an either/or.

Online has similar overheads, the store is only one step, they tax and graft at them all. Good principle thought from the naive, stupid on the ground. But a lot of people will like it better. They get to feel upstanding when they eat a chocolate on Christmas and boy innit that just progress. Or something.

 

[Samson]

My point is that the illegal and legal online selling of weed has largely the same overheads and processes, as in grow the stuff, pack it and post it. While I do not know the details, the differences between the two are that the legal seller has to deal with bureaucracy and a 15% tax, and the illegal has to deal with the drug war. And the illegal can sell for roughly half the price of the legal. Just from an economics 101 standpoint (which I have not done, mind you) this would seem to indicate that the bureaucracy is more of a problem than all the police and other resources that are put into the drug war.

 

[Farm Boy]

The drug war carries costs that God Money cares less about. The risk borne in that situation is the illegal seller/grower, and it's not capital risk up front. His/her lost life quality while imprisoned is also a tax since that's how society has found to monetize through taxed channels the economic activity that sought to evade its grasp, but you don't account for that one at the dope register.

You know how people grow tomatoes? If you let weed go, it'd be like tomatoes. But instead we have millions upon millions in tax revenue. That buys a lot of the oldest and most upstanding types of protection.

 

[warpus]

It's kind of artificial though. It's not just weed it's any drug.

If you need to use chemicals for fun you're kind of incapable of entertaining yourself otherwise. That's ignoring things like addiction etc.

To me it's a weakness, lack of self control, and a lack of imagination.

Isn't that describing addicts who are physically addicted to something and often need professional help to get off it?

Casual users do not fall in this category, and yet you seem to bundle them in as well

 

[Narz]

Smoke particles in lungs if nothing else and/or ultimately a boring person.

If you need to use pot for the high or fun it's kinda boring to me.

You could say that about posting on an internet forum.

It's kind of artificial though. It's not just weed it's any drug.

If you need to use chemicals for fun you're kind of incapable of entertaining yourself otherwise. That's ignoring things like addiction etc.

To me it's a weakness, lack of self control, and a lack of imagination.

You could say the same thing about anything. Having to go online for entertainment for instance. Why not sit in a quiet room alone and be happy w your thoughts alone?

Getting addicted to anything is foolish.

Pot isn't physically addictive.

And if the subject is boring why spend so much time on it?

 

[emzie]

It's kind of artificial though. It's not just weed it's any drug.

If you need to use chemicals for fun you're kind of incapable of entertaining yourself otherwise. That's ignoring things like addiction etc.

To me it's a weakness, lack of self control, and a lack of imagination.

I am incapable of wanting to exist without chemicals. Most come from the pharmacy. Some come from extracting them from the dried parts of a plant. I welcome anyone who thinks I am weak to exist a week in my shoes.

My point is that the illegal and legal online selling of weed has largely the same overheads and processes, as in grow the stuff, pack it and post it. While I do not know the details, the differences between the two are that the legal seller has to deal with bureaucracy and a 15% tax, and the illegal has to deal with the drug war. And the illegal can sell for roughly half the price of the legal. Just from an economics 101 standpoint (which I have not done, mind you) this would seem to indicate that the bureaucracy is more of a problem than all the police and other resources that are put into the drug war.

Legal weed is convenient, and it's cheaper than illegal weed used to be. Five years ago I was spending $240 an ounce for mids. I just bought an ounce (28g) for C$98 ($76 US, £57), $111 with tax. Quality: Dank.

Spoiler dank proof :

Could I save money on the black market? Yeah, but at what cost? I would save $13 dollars buying this same ounce on a reserve (which is more of a grey market). If I was travelling and passed a reserve, I'd stop and stock up. Not paying tax is nice, but supporting indigenous-owned businesses at the expense of the Canadian or Quebec governments? Hell yeah I'm doing that. If I bought it online, I could save $50 / ounce... if I bought at least 4 ounces. That is a big savings, but it also carries risks: outright scammers, Canada Post seizing your package, technically breaking the law, no product quality assurance, dealing with shady people, etc.... Some people still use the black market, but most of us are content with the legal prices.

• Just from an economics 101 standpoint (which I have not done, mind you) this would seem to indicate that the bureaucracy is more of a problem than all the police and other resources that are put into the drug war.

What. The "bureaucracy" is government income. How could tax revenues ever be more of a problem than police expenditures?

 

[Farm Boy]

They're the same. One maintains the other. Pretty directly in this case.

 

[Samson]

Legal weed is convenient, and it's cheaper than illegal weed used to be. Five years ago I was spending $240 an ounce for mids. I just bought an ounce (28g) for C$98 ($76 US, £57), $111 with tax. Quality: Dank.

Spoiler dank proof :

View attachment 615395

Could I save money on the black market? Yeah, but at what cost? I would save $13 dollars buying this same ounce on a reserve (which is more of a grey market). If I was travelling and passed a reserve, I'd stop and stock up. Not paying tax is nice, but supporting indigenous-owned businesses at the expense of the Canadian or Quebec governments? Hell yeah I'm doing that. If I bought it online, I could save $50 / ounce... if I bought at least 4 ounces. That is a big savings, but it also carries risks: outright scammers, Canada Post seizing your package, technically breaking the law, no product quality assurance, dealing with shady people, etc.... Some people still use the black market, but most of us are content with the legal prices.

• Just from an economics 101 standpoint (which I have not done, mind you) this would seem to indicate that the bureaucracy is more of a problem than all the police and other resources that are put into the drug war.

What. The "bureaucracy" is government income. How could tax revenues ever be more of a problem than police expenditures?

That is really cheap, and cheaper than I am aware of online. It is also far cheaper than I found with a browser around the California online shops. Good buds too.

I would say the tax is government income, the bureaucracy is the form filling and licence application that helps no one and costs everyone time. Purely a semantic point.

 

[Berzerker]

Wait just to apply for one of the limited spots cost 6 figs? Do you get your money back if passed over?

politicians make it costly to produce weed legally and then point at black market pot undercutting their system as proof legalizing weed didn't get rid of the black market

 

[warpus]

Unfortunately North American culture is built on top of puritan values, and so Canadian politicians tend to put roadblocks in place when you want to sell or buy intoxicants. Within reason it's all fine, but that's how you get a monopoly and higher prices and annoyances for customers.

There's still enough anti-weed stigma in some parts of our society to make politicians eager to make it more restrictive than alcohol, so they can point to these roadblocks in case something bad happens - as proof that they had the publics best interest in mind all along. These rules also create barriers to entry into the marketplace and limits it to those who have enough capital to invest in the requirements - some of these people are friends with politicians nudge nudge wink wink grope grope

 

[Zardnaar]

The logical steps I am examining are:

• Anyone who uses weed is stupid
• That is because weed is bad for you
• Alcohol is worse for you than weed
• Therefore anyone who uses alcohol is stupid

You get what I am saying? I am certainly not arguing against that all drugs come will significant downsides, but to say that anyone who uses them is inherently stupid seems unjustifiable to me. Especially when so much drug use can be seen as self medication for SLS (and I defiantly include alcohol in that).

Except weed is generally putting particles in your lungs and effects your brain/perception bin very small amounts eg 1-2 spots.

Shouldn't be putter Ng any particles in your lungs.

 

[emzie]

That is really cheap, and cheaper than I am aware of online. It is also far cheaper than I found with a browser around the California online shops. Good buds too.

I would say the tax is government income, the bureaucracy is the form filling and licence application that helps no one and costs everyone time. Purely a semantic point.

Those things don't exist anymore. Legalized recreational cannabis doesn't require licensing or forms. You can walk into any dispensary in Ontario and buy up to an ounce of weed, provided you're 19+.

edit: and it's not like they're hard to get to, either

 

[Zardnaar]

I am incapable of wanting to exist without chemicals. Most come from the pharmacy. Some come from extracting them from the dried parts of a plant. I welcome anyone who thinks I am weak to exist a week in my shoes.



Legal weed is convenient, and it's cheaper than illegal weed used to be. Five years ago I was spending $240 an ounce for mids. I just bought an ounce (28g) for C$98 ($76 US, £57), $111 with tax. Quality: Dank.

Spoiler dank proof :

View attachment 615395

Could I save money on the black market? Yeah, but at what cost? I would save $13 dollars buying this same ounce on a reserve (which is more of a grey market). If I was travelling and passed a reserve, I'd stop and stock up. Not paying tax is nice, but supporting indigenous-owned businesses at the expense of the Canadian or Quebec governments? Hell yeah I'm doing that. If I bought it online, I could save $50 / ounce... if I bought at least 4 ounces. That is a big savings, but it also carries risks: outright scammers, Canada Post seizing your package, technically breaking the law, no product quality assurance, dealing with shady people, etc.... Some people still use the black market, but most of us are content with the legal prices.

• Just from an economics 101 standpoint (which I have not done, mind you) this would seem to indicate that the bureaucracy is more of a problem than all the police and other resources that are put into the drug war.

What. The "bureaucracy" is government income. How could tax revenues ever be more of a problem than police expenditures?

Your chemicals are from a doctor? I'm talking about mind influencing substances for recreational purposes. Weed in this case can apply same argument to booze etc.

I'm also anti putting anything in your lungs eg smoking, vaping etc for recreational. If it's medicine that's different.

Note I'm pro legalization I just think it's a bad idea (along with abusing alcohol or anything that effects perception/mind or lungs).

 

[Narz]

If it's medicine that's different.

Different things can be medicine for different people and you don't need a doctor to tell you that either.

Being an adult is about being able to responsibly make choices including about caffeine, cannabis, etc.

The internet is more damaging to memory and attention span than cannabis