Will an election in Greece be beneficial for the country?

[Kyriakos]

I haven't counted them, but i would like to think that this is the 666th thread on Greece in the Colosseum in all those years (obviously many more exist in the CIV areas). And it should be so, for it is the time for a devilish poll.

In light of the announced Referendum on the double question of accepting the new Euro deal, and granting a vote of confidence to the socialist government, set to take place some time after January, do you think a general election (which at the moment seems to be the obvious result of that referendum) will help Greece, the EU, or both?

My own view is that things cannot realistically get any worse than now. This charade of a government has utterly ruined the country, made all wrong choices, failed to limit tax evasion, cut dramatically wages and pension funds leading to a depression.
A new government (it probably will be a coalition one between the two righ-wing parties, ND and LAOS) just can't be equally bad no matter how hard it tries, at least that is what i tend to hope...

Anyway, poll will be up in a minute

 

[amadeus]

Privatize Greece. As you yourself said, how could the government make it any worse?

 

[Kyriakos]

Actually it used to be a majorly private-owned economy, right before the dreadful coup of the colonels. After democracy was restored the governments tried to make everything state-owned.

It goes without saying that the coup was a nightmare, just noting that not even the moronic colonels had so devastating policies, and surely anything before them was better.

 

[Babbler]

A new government (it probably will be a coalition one between the two righ-wing parties, ND and LAOS) just can't be equally bad no matter how hard it tries, at least that is what i tend to hope...

Famous last words, man.

 

[Leoreth]

My own view is that things cannot realistically get any worse than now. This charade of a government has utterly ruined the country, made all wrong choices, failed to limit tax evasion, cut dramatically wages and pension funds leading to a depression.
A new government (it probably will be a coalition one between the two righ-wing parties, ND and LAOS) just can't be equally bad no matter how hard it tries, at least that is what i tend to hope...

You haven't yet answered that question in the other thread: what do you think a new government will do differently? What can it do differently? The only meaningful alternative I see is to outright quit the Euro. Do they want to do that?

Else you're acting highly irrationally.

 

[Joecoolyo]

A good occupation or two should set you guys straight.

 

[AL_DA_GREAT]

Greece needs to collapse and be rebuilt.

 

[Squonk]

Elections mean promises. Promises mean high hopes. High hopes mean disappointment. Disappointment means protests. We have enough of that in Greece.

 

[Yeekim]

My own view is that things cannot realistically get any worse than now. This charade of a government has utterly ruined the country

From wiki:

Upon inauguration, Papandreou's government revealed that its finances were far worse than previous announcements, with a budget deficit of 12.7% of GDP, four times more than the eurozone's limit, and a public debt of $410 billion.[8] This announcement only served to worsen the severe crisis the Greek economy was undergoing, with an unemployment rate of 10%[9] and the country's debt rating being lowered to BBB+, the lowest in the eurozone.

That they got a country already deep, deep, deep in a crapper.

made all wrong choices

What should've been done differently?

failed to limit tax evasion

I'll give you that.

cut dramatically wages and pension funds leading to a depression.

Do you think spending cuts were unnecessary?

 

[Kyriakos]

From wiki:

That they got a country already deep, deep, deep in a crapper.

What should've been done differently?

I'll give you that.

Do you think spending cuts were unnecessary?

Well, if you actually think that this past year made things in any way better, or rather erase that, if you actually think that this past year did not make things unbelievably worse, then i cannot really argue anything here. The mere fact that he had a debt around 100% of the GNP, and managed to make it explode to past 150% in less than 2 years should tell you how to spell his accomplishments.

If Greece was to leave the Monetary union (obviously not the EU) then it would be best to do that when all this started, and not now, after so many new loans. Now the only viable option is disastrously worse than the one which could be had in the beginning.

As for spending cuts, it does not take a genius to realize that if you cut all benefits/income you will in the medium turn lose a lot more, since the people will react by buying drastically less anyway. He raised the tax so many times that by now the market has stopped nearly utterly to function. Should we congratulate him for that as well?

Anyway, i am sick of this. I feel a bit like Flaubert after the Franco-Prussian war. I wish those Prussians were made extinct by now :/

 

[Verbose]

The referedum is supposed to take place - what? - about two months from now...

In this situation, that's a looong time. I'm depressingly starting to feel there might not be that much for the Greeks to vote about by then. Things might be decided for them, outside Greece, well before that...

 

[Winner]

That tends to happen when you are dependent on other people for money to keep your out of the street, figuratively speaking.

I mean, it's Greece going cap in hand to the Germans, so what do they expect? I think that by calling this referendum, thus making it sure the markets will remain volatile the next two months before the referendum takes place, Papandreou will make the Germans snap, finally. They won't help him now, I am sure they're already cooking up a way to kick Greece out of the Eurozone.

 

[Lillefix]

They say it's a gamble to let the Greeks vote over the issue.But it might also be a gamble not to let them voter over this. You can only push a people so far before something really bad happens. But the referendum needs to take place NOW. Surely they can arrange a referendum in less than two months.

 

[Tani Coyote]

Elections are always good, provided they're real and not for show. Elections demonstrate the power of the vote over violence, and allow us to address our grievances like reasonable, mature human beings rather than grabbing guns, screaming a battlecry, and randomly shooting at eachother.

As for Greece in particular, if the government isn't any good, then yes, an election to throw it out would be great. While one can't always blame the government for the situation in a country's economy, it sounds like this government did its part to make things worse. Just don't make the mistake of voting in their opponents when those opponents likely screwed the country over during their tenure as well.

 

[Silurian]

There may be a govenment of national unity

 

[christos200]

There may be a govenment of national unity

That is the best joke i ever heard. If papandreou and samaras decide to ever create a govenment of national unity i will become shaolin monk.

 

[Leoreth]

Here lies the problem. Not even the political elite realizes that they need to get over their petty power struggles to save their country. Because that's all I see the opposition doing here (except of course those who like in the "everything would be fine if Europe wouldn't oppress us" fairy land).

This doesn't mean that I consider Pasok to be in any way preferable to ND. But I do think that the Greek options are limited enough that another government won't make a difference and it's definitely not worth the resulting chaos.

 

[Silurian]

That is the best joke i ever heard. If papandreou and samaras decide to ever create a govenment of national unity i will become shaolin monk.

Well the joke is nearly a month old

From Athens News

8 Oct 2011

Financial daily Imerisia said without citing sources that George Papandreou would be willing to resign if this helped winning political consensus for a coalition government with a strong parliamentary majority

The government dismissed the report. "This is not true," government spokesman Ilias Mosialos told Reuters

http://www.athensnews.gr/portal/11/48780

from BBC

Shortly afterwards, another MP from Mr Papandreou's centre-left Pasok party, Vasso Papandreou (no relation), called for a government of national unity, to be followed by snap elections.

"I call on the president to convene the council of political leaders with the goal of forming a government of national salvation in view of safeguarding the EU package agreed on 27 October, and then to immediately hold elections," said Ms Papandreou, who chairs the parliamentary committee on economic affairs.

Antonis Samaras, leader of the main opposition New Democrats, met Greek President Karolos Papoulias for talks on Tuesday morning.

"In order to save himself, Mr Papandreou has posed a dilemma of blackmail that puts our future and our position in Europe in danger," Mr Samaras said after the meeting.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-15538809

and the joke is still going.

 

[Kyriakos]

I am unhappy with all this. Really the signs were obvious to anyone having half a brain. It should have never come to this though.

Sigh.

I hope that in the future there won't be tales beggining with "Once upon a time, there was a country..."