2020 US Election (Part One)

[Traitorfish]

Couldn't care less. Voting "enthusiastically" is a luxury. Voting for the best available after due deliberation is a responsibility.

Do you imagine that voters will behave in ways which are consistent with your theory of civic responsibility?

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Do you imagine that voters will behave in ways which are consistent with your theory of civic responsibility?

In limited numbers, generally consisting of the more mature and leaving the disillusioned youth to grow into it.

Do you imagine that sixty million Americans voted for Trump enthusiastically? Do you imagine that every one of the sixty million who voted for Clinton did so enthusiastically?

 

[Farm Boy]

Do you imagine that sixty million Americans voted for Trump enthusiastically? Do you imagine that every one of the sixty million who voted for Clinton did so enthusiastically?

I am totally comfortable with the assumption that at least 120 million Americans are utterly batshit.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I am totally comfortable with the assumption that at least 120 million Americans are totally and utterly bat****.

And yet still responsible enough to vote. Mysterious, isn't it?

 

[Farm Boy]

Not sure that batshit is a net drain on motivation.

 

[Birdjaguar]

Not sure in what world nearly 50% of the vote is "a little band". Besides, Biden won't get a majority either, it remains to be seen if he will get a plurality and by what tiny margin.
Using your curious logic according to which percentages are the same regardless of how many people are running, Biden obviously will get less of a percentage than Bernie in 2016 even if he does great, so using Tim-logic he is a loser and part of the minority.

Gnash your teeth and tear your garments all you want. Sanders is done. It's time for his supporters to put on their big boy pants and get real. Sanders ran a good campaign that wasn't good enough to attract enough voters to his tent.

Bloomberg is out. I hope he takes his defeat with good graces. I remember when Nixon, after losing the Presidency to Kenny and the California Governorship to Pat Brown, was asked if he thought there'd ever be a Black President. Nixon replied, "Only if he run against me."

Let's hope he is willing to drop another $100 million on anti Trump ads.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Let's hope he is willing to drop another $100 million on anti Trump ads.

Even if he isn't, the question Biden was facing three days ago; "How do you plan to run a successful campaign with no infrastructure at all? You don't even have an office in a whole lot of these states." can now be answered "Yeah, I'm using Bloomberg's so it's all good." I saw Yang talking yesterday about how the day he folded his campaign a representative from the Bloomberg campaign appeared in every office he had and took over the lease and hired every staffer at 50% above whatever Yang was paying them if they wanted the job, with a contract through November. That infrastructure was the big prize in him getting stomped yesterday, and Biden has it all now.

 

[Birdjaguar]

If his goal is to oust Trump, then he is on the team.

 

[Kyriakos]

Gnash your teeth and tear your garments all you want. Sanders is done. It's time for his supporters to put on their big boy pants and get real. Sanders ran a good campaign that wasn't good enough to attract enough voters to his tent.

Here, have a mirror

 

[Birdjaguar]

Here, have a mirror

Oh so clever, but it doesn't actually say anything.

 

[Kyriakos]

Well, if you lead with "gnash your teeth", it's what you get, non?
Anyway, let's see how Biden does in the next debate, when he will be the focal point and there won't be 2000 other candidates. In theory Biden can be eloquent ( ).

 

[Zardnaar]

High turn out breaking for Biden.

https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5e5f31fbc5b6732f50ea138b

 

[Berzerker]

https://www.rollingstone.com/politi...0-democratic-primary-turnout-problems-960784/

Trump's getting big numbers without an opponent to speak of, but that study doesn't include Super Tuesday. The link says less than needed Dem turnout may be masking the Trump hate, people dont care as much about which Dem is nominated but will turn out for the general election.

 

[onejayhawk]

If disillusioned Bernie supporters vote Biden I imagine the Dems will keep pushing healthcare. If they sit it out and throw the election to Trump not only do you fail to get an improvement on healthcare but you have the GoP actively trying to dismantle the ACA. Trump's been distracted with mid terms/re-election/impeachment but I remember 2017. Only reason ACA survived was because McCain voted no and he's dead now. Trump wins he keeps stacking the judiciary, RBG isn't getting any younger and you can always bounce back in 2024/28. Sanders lost, the progressives underperformed in 2018. The downside of promising the moon is disillusionment. Even if Sanders turns it around and wins student loan forgiveness and a green new deal are going nowhere.

ACA has to survive the Supreme Court again, though not until after Trump is reelected.

Democrats certainly over promised in 2018. Trump, ironically, came out as more truthful.

So we let an extreme minority run the country or probably lose to Trump? If Sanders stood in New Zealand with proportional representation and a vastly more liberal electorate guess what? He still loses. He would be leader of a minor party with 5-13% of the vote. At that point he can compromise and go into coalition government or be on the outside and get nothing passed. A brokered convention is essentially coalition building in a proportional system. Atm he can't even win a majority of people who bother voting in Democratic primaries. It's not like he full is of bad ideas.

An extreme minority has been running the Democratic party for years. That's not new. What is new is that they are openly alienating the core voters of 20+ years ago.

Trump did out-poll any Democrat in every state. In Texas, he almost out-polled all of them combined.

This is only a fraction of the Democrat party voting. In the US they're heavily concentrated on the coasts. That's not where the election needs to be won. 2018 midterms the progressives underperformed. The swing against Trump was in the suburbs where centrist candidates carried the day. The Democratic party is a rough coalition of 3-4 parties or factions. Each faction is maybe 10-12% of the overall electorate. So the Uber progressives at the most would be maybe 20% of the electorate. If they're hardline about it and don't compromise they can't win. Let's just say Bernie gets 40% and Biden gets less and Warren and Tulsi carry 30%. The DNC decide and super delegates decide to support Sanders. He goes on to win the general election. Yay America is socialist. However the other 60% of the Democratic party don't have to support his policies and they answer to their electorates not the president and not the progressive wing of the Democrat party. Assuming Sanders has the Senate as well to pass any laws he has to get the majority of the other 50% on board. Even if he gets 60% instead of 40% that's still enough to torpedo anything he wants to do. So he has to compromise. If a president is super popular or has enough "political capital" to convince the rest of the party to fall in line they have to work out where they can spend that political capital. It's generally enough to pass 1 and probably no more than 2 pieces of significant legislation. Trump managed to pass 1 with a compliant party.

The main issue in these elections seems to be healthcare. Not free tertiary, not global warming, not LBGTQ rights. The other problem with populists us they promise the moon, sometimes get elected and then discover they can't deliver. Which often gets them voted out. You've only got two years to pass legislation and then it's midterms. Lose control like Trump did in 2018, no laws passed.

Is it only a fraction of the party, or is this what is left of the party? Signs of fragmentation are everywhere. The sudden coalescing behind Biden is an admission that they do not expect to win the White House, so they are trying to salvage something, eg the House. This is past ugly and into desperate.

J

 

[Timsup2nothin]

This is past ugly and into desperate.

J

Indeed. I'm pretty sure you passed them both so long ago you can't even look over your shoulder and see them.

 

[Zardnaar]

ACA has to survive the Supreme Court again, though not until after Trump is reelected.

Democrats certainly over promised in 2018. Trump, ironically, came out as more truthful.


An extreme minority has been running the Democratic party for years. That's not new. What is new is that they are openly alienating the core voters of 20+ years ago.

Trump did out-poll any Democrat in every state. In Texas, he almost out-polled all of them combined.


Is it only a fraction of the party, or is this what is left of the party? Signs of fragmentation are everywhere. The sudden coalescing behind Biden is an admission that they do not expect to win the White House, so they are trying to salvage something, eg the House. This is past ugly and into desperate.

J

I wouldn't call it that.

People percieve Biden as more electible. Find out in November.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

I wouldn't call it that.

People percieve Biden as more electible. Find out in November.

He's already been challenged to bet and folded like a ten dollar suit. Best ignored.

 

[cardgame]

For everyone that, for some reason, has no idea why Biden is unpalatable:

The damage Biden can do is far worse. When we talk about Biden it is important to note that this is a man who dedicated his Senate career to cutting Social Security, cutting Medicare/Medicaid, and passing "tough on crime" (aka blatantly racist) legislation. We are talking about a man who wants a "compromise" on climate change and is taking donations from the fossil fuel industry. We are talking about a man who called Republicans cowards for not cutting Social Security and who served as VP in an administration that built and filled the cages that foreign kids are being put into. Shall we talk about his record on LGBT+ issues or marijuana? Shall we take a peek at his doners list? Biden is, and always has been, a Dixiecrat through and through.

On the surface, he doesnt necessarily sound any worse than Trump. The danger is the media that frames the national conversation, like when Obama was president, will ignore all of terrible stuff he is doing and shower him with praise because they got their neolib savior. I'm not saying Bernie-or-bust, but only an absolute imbecile would think Biden is an ally.

Never forget, Biden is the racist conservative that Obama chose to appeal to racist conservatives.

Once the Biden administration is over, as with Obama before, the American people will realize that they have been hoodwinked (again) and that they are no better off than before, possibly even worse off. Once that happens, they will respond by electing a fascist so extreme they make Trump look like Jimmy Carter.

and you people think he's going to help improve healthcare

 

[tuckerkao]

For everyone that, for some reason, has no idea why Biden is unpalatable:

and you people think he's going to help improve healthcare

Biden is a safer choice for the moderate Democrats. He's a bit too old for some voters, but carries the momentum from the Obama legacy years. African American voter turnouts are just way too important to ignore.

Biden's vice presidential companion choice will be very decisive whether he can beat Trump or not in Nov, 2020.

 

[cardgame]

Biden is a safer choice for the moderate Democrats.

mlkthewhitemoderate.txt