Coronavirus. The n(in)th sequel.

[Takhisis]

I don't think we have good data on usefulness of tests in general, since we've never done a good job of defining what their use is.

Why can’t America fix its Covid-19 testing problems?

The subtitle basically sums it up: "US testing numbers have been consistently bad because there is no real strategy."

Well, we get the same here.

Thanks for the article.

 

[Takhisis]

↑Which leads us to…

Maybe? We have a wealth of evidence of governments that - despite having access to the correct information - still manage to bungle their response to the ongoing pandemic.

Well, yes, but, while not sufficient, correct information is still a necessary factor for good policy. You have to know what to rule on if you want to rule at all.

 

[AmazonQueen]

↑Which leads us to…

Well, yes, but, while not sufficient, correct information is still a necessary factor for good policy. You have to know what to rule on if you want to rule at all.

I wish Bojo realised that.

 

[Gorbles]

↑Which leads us to…

Well, yes, but, while not sufficient, correct information is still a necessary factor for good policy. You have to know what to rule on if you want to rule at all.

Oh, for sure. But I'm more with Lexicus on the cat being out of the bag by that point, proverbially speaking.

 

[amadeus]

On the chicoms: if we had known where the coronavirus had come from, I think we’d be seeing less of the of “just asking questions” skepticism.

On mandatory vaccines: think 150 years ago we would have let in a bunch of sickly people into the country when there was a scientifically-proven inoculation regime? Most adults then weren’t even allowed to vote. Old Johnny Law would have put the kibosh on this baloney.

 

[Takhisis]

Oh, for sure. But I'm more with Lexicus on the cat being out of the bag by that point, proverbially speaking.

You've dragged my attention to this point:

@amadeus, another libertarian, understands this.

amadeus understands that being alive is a necessary requirement for being free.

 

[El_Machinae]

The government has an absolute right to require people to either get vaccinated or live on reservations, period, end of story.

This won't be true, especially with Delta

- We can set a minimum reasonable standard for 'danger' that someone else poses, but that's about it. To the best of my understanding, someone who's fought off the infection is a lower risk than someone who got double-vaccinated. It makes no sense to deprive that person of liberty, especially if it's too easy to see the 'reasoning' as just a doily to cover regressive desires.

- Most broadly, each vaccinated person has a percent chance that they're actually dangerous at the time where their rights are being impeded upon. It will be some ten day period in a function with whatever chance there is that they're asymptomatic. It's detaining someone for what they might be. There's an expedience argument that we might have no choice, but the bias will always have to be towards minimizing the impingement, not justifying whatever arbitrary impingement makes the most-scared person feel safe.

 

[Takhisis]

I wish Bojo realised that.

BeauJo.

But more seriously:

The government has an absolute right to require people to either get vaccinated or live on reservations, period, end of story.

I'm living through the failure of such measures. Not least because, humans being humans, there's always someone who'll break the rules just to break them.

 

[Drakle]

Covid-19 has OFFICIALLY killed 1 in 500 Americans

BREAKING: One in 500 US residents has died of Covid-19, according to a@CNN analysis of Johns Hopkins University and US Census Bureau data.

That's just official deaths. There is excess mortality. There are the people suffering from COVID complications, which can in the worst cases, basically be dead, being almost brain dead. Tons of long COVID.

Yet we still have all these brain dead takes from the Death Cultists. No, it's not an experimental vaccine. It's gone through the full testing process and has been given to BILLIONS of people. Billions. Most medicines never reach that number across their entire product lifetime. And there are non mRNA vaccines available.

The entire global economy is still limping by, waiting for this pandemic to end. The selfish anti-vaxxers are burning billion-dollar bills every day and laughing.


In terms of the hot spots, the Deep South is slowly tapering off in terms of cases, with the hotspots now migrating more to the Upper South. Tennesse, West Virginia, Kentucky, Southern Ohio. Other areas have hotspots as well, like Wyoming and Alaska.

 

[Lexicus]

The selfish anti-vaxxers are burning billion-dollar bills every day and laughing.

This makes them sound cooler than they are

 

[amadeus]

For some perspective, that’s nine times the battle death rate of Operation Desert Storm (1 in 4500)

Also less than half as dangerous as the 1989 invasion of Panama (1 in 1180)

How about the most dangerous job, with 33 times the average work fatality rate in the in the U.S.—loggermen? 1 in 900.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Why are antivaxxers obsessed with horse medication? If they don't believe that covid exists.. what the hell do horses have to do with anything?
I mean, I don't expect there to be any semblance of logical thought or reason.. but like.. what

Covid is fake until, they have it, are being hit hard and now suddenly the reports that 99% of the dying being unvaccinated rings alarm bells
With the vaccine no longer an option, they are desperate for any cure. Since the hive mind tells them that horse dewormer is the solution that works thats good enough for them.
That whom they trust.

 

[FriendlyFire]

What a smart

Bob Enyart, conservative US radio host who refused vaccine, dies of COVID-19
Conservative US radio host Pastor Robert “Bob” Enyart, who swore off COVID-19 vaccines and gained notoriety by mocking AIDS sufferers, has died from complications due to coronavirus.
“Bob Enyart was one of the smartest, and without question the wisest person I’ve known.”

“We have a right, even an obligation to worship him (God), and that’s without government interference,” Enyart told CNN following the ruling.
In August, his radio show’s website said he and his wife Cheryl “have sworn off taking the Pfizer, Moderna, and Johnson vaccines”.

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/heal...ho-refused-vaccine-dies-of-covid-19-c-3968557

 

[innonimatu]

Interrupting the bootleg dewormer misinformation chat to report we got our second doses of an actual (AZ) vaccine, helping to get Canberra out of lockdown living with Covid ASAP.

You are aware that things will go badly in Australia despite vaccines? Living with covid is a terrible idea.

Abut the US, it seems that everything covid is going through the same social/political fights and biases that permeate society there. Take masking: the servants are mandated to wear them, the wealthy not? No way to handle a pandemic effectively in such a society.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

That's true. The vaccine also reduces transmission somewhat, but whether it reduces it to flu-transmission levels is a question I don't have the answer to.

Has that been verified with studies? There was some concern that some of the benefit against spreading it while vaccinated was offset by the increased chances of being asymptomatic or not recognizing that what a person has is COVID while still capable of spreading it. I would be interested in what the numbers say for this, if we have them.

amadeus understands that being alive is a necessary requirement for being free.

So is individual choice wrt assumption of one's own risk.

 

[Snowygerry]

You are aware that things will go badly in Australia despite vaccines? Living with covid is a terrible idea.

Abut the US, it seems that everything covid is going through the same social/political fights and biases that permeate society there. Take masking: the servants are mandated to wear them, the wealthy not? No way to handle a pandemic effectively in such a society.

That's only if you live in a banana republic - here is how it should be

Koning Filip en koningin Mathilde brengen bezoek aan door overstromingen getroffen gebied (msn.com)

 

[Lexicus]

So is individual choice wrt assumption of one's own risk.

Individual choice wrt assumption of one's own risk is a meaningless phrase with a pandemic virus spreading. Your risk depends on the behavior of other people. You live in a society. I know you hate this but it is nonetheless true.

Abut the US, it seems that everything covid is going through the same social/political fights and biases that permeate society there. Take masking: the servants are mandated to wear them, the wealthy not? No way to handle a pandemic effectively in such a society.

There are some good points in here. I for one think it's very interesting how people put AOC on a pedestal and expect her not to act like a liberal...

 

[Lexicus]

It's detaining someone for what they might be.

 

[The_J]

https://www.science.org/content/art...ries-continue-keep-virus-bay-once-they-reopen

But the spread of the highly infectious Delta variant, the economic burden of closed borders, lockdown fatigue, and increasing vaccine availability are changing the equation. “In the long term [zero COVID] is not really economically sustainable,” says Ben Cowling, an epidemiologist at the University of Hong Kong (HKU). “Countries are going to need to test out different approaches to find the right balance between infection prevention and control and normalizing societal activities,” adds epidemiologist Keiji Fukuda, also at HKU.

[...]

Australia is in the midst of a severe Delta-driven outbreak, with close to 2000 new cases daily that started with a single infection in Sydney, in the state of New South Wales, in mid-June. Nationwide elimination is no longer an option, says Ivo Mueller, an infectious disease epidemiologist at the Walter and Eliza Hall Institute of Medical Research in Parkville, Australia. “The Delta variant is sufficiently entrenched in New South Wales and Victoria that you won’t get that to zero,” he says. Meanwhile, lockdowns and other restrictions that affect roughly half of the country’s population of 25 million have led to large and sometimes violent demonstrations.

 

[Gorbles]

I for one think it's very interesting how people put AOC on a pedestal and expect her not to act like a liberal...

I mean, I'm an advocate of "never make someone your personal hero" / "don't put people on pedestals", but what about attending the Met Gala makes her liberal? The only takes I've seen on this have been purely bad-faith conservative gotchas, like "if she was a socialist why does she spend money on dresses", or similar. At this point I'd take any other perspective

Personally, I completely agree (looking at the Substack piece) that folks should be masking up where possible, and that there is a double standard in enforcing it (well, not in the UK anymore but hey that's a different topic), but I also know not everyone agrees with how useful masks are. That said, it manages to completely ignore a well-made point about sporting events, where contact is also rife (and these are allowed). The problem, to me, isn't of "elites" vs. whatever non-"elites" are called. It's how capitalism dictates mandates such as these and their enforcement. Sports is allowed because sports makes money. Support for people isolating and not able to work? Nope, get back out on the job (this, again, has happened here in the UK).

By isolating the issue to focus solely on "elites", it paints a skewed picture of the actual problem.