Iron and Blood 2 - Game Thread



1819

The Scandinavian Church Conference

The people of Scandinavia are feeling very anxious about the world situation and the recent wars and now more wars hang heavily in their minds. Some even held fears for their children's future as to what world awaits them. They have been raising their concerns with their church leaders. These were then passed onto the Bishops for each region and eventually reaching the Archbishops themselves. It should be noted that they are all of the Lutheran faith of Christianity.

With the recent unions of Sweden, Denmark and Norway (and hopefully Finland as well), the respective state churches decided that they need to hold a conference to discuss how they should be run and led. The Archbishop of Sweden - Jacob Axelsson Lindblom, was appointed to be chair at this conference. Matters to be discussed were as follows; Wars, Leadership and Autonomy, Missions by other religions, Government Relationships. All bishops from Sweden, Norway, Denmark and Finland were invited to discuss these important matters. The conference will be held at the Cathedral of Uppsala in Sweden.

Conference Begins

Swedish, Danish, Norwegian and even Finnish bishops eventually all made their way to Uppsala to begin their discussions. Many bishops already knew each other well, even those from other nations as they were all Lutheran and attended the same training schools, so this made discussion easier.

1. War

The first matter to be discussed and probably the most important is War and how this will affect Scandinavia. The Swedish Minister for Religion was invited to explain the Scandinavian Union Neutrality Law in detail. He said that the key principle is that under no circumstance were any agreements to be entered into with any other nation. He explained that the risk of even a free trade agreement could be construed by others as a form of alliance with the other nation. Some nations, even offered Non-aggression or even Defensive Pacts for preferential trade agreements, so for this reason, no agreements will be signed with any nation and our Neutrality will continue to be emphasised. The Minister also said that with the recent declarations of war, our Neutrality position has again been emphasised at our Danish Internal Affairs office.

The bishops then discussed these matters and voted on the message to give to their respective flocks; "The Church believes that the Scandinavian Government is leading the right path, by staying NEUTRAL in these troubled times and War is unlikely to return to Scandinavia for some time."

2. Leadership and Autonomy

The second matter to be discussed is Leadership of the Scandinavia Church. Do we need four archbishops or just one, and who will be the head of the Scandinavian Church? This discussion became very heated when talk led to who should lead the church. The Archbishop of Sweden then stood up and said. "There is no Scandinavian Church, each nation in the union already has their own church and their own archbishop to lead them, this should continue as before." This seemed to calm the bishops down and they then agreed that there should be no change to leadership and will continue as before.

It was agreed the archbishops would meet annually to discuss current events and religious matters within the Scandinavian Union, however they would continue to lead their church in their respective nations.

3. Catholic and Jewish Missions

The Archbishop of Denmark then raised the "Incident at Copenhagen Gates". The Papal States sent Jesuits to the Scandinavian Union to preach to the population, based on the assumption that because it is a secular state, that they would be free to travel here and spread their word. They had travelled overland and were determined to reach Stockholm and preach. When they reached the gates of the city of Copenhagen an angry crowd forced the Jesuit party to reconsider their mission. A Rabbi party also decided to return and not proceed further.

While all agreed that the people of Scandinavia were free to worship as they want, the time is not right for other religions and orders to attempt to enter Scandinavia and preach. They also noted that as virtually all Scandinavians follow the teachings of the State Lutheran Churches, it would be unlikely that many people will want to hear other religions. In addition, given the events of 1814 and the suspicions any foreigners would be under, the safety of foreign preachers could not be assured.

It is hoped that this decision does not cause a diplomatic incident, so the Swedish Minister of Religion was instructed to pass this decision onto the Swedish Government for a more formal response to the Pope.

4. Government Relationships

The final matter to be discussed is the church’s relationship to the respective governments of the nations in Scandinavian Union. It was discussed that it had already being agreed that the each nation would continue to have their own church leadership and archbishops, so how will the church communicate with the government.

Norway and Denmark, had their own assemblies and First Ministers, and Sweden has a parliament and Prime Minister and Cabinet who reported to the King of Sweden, Norway and Denmark. Finland situation is still unconfirmed. Given this situation it was decided that the archbishops should continue to report to their respective national governments and assemblies in the first instance for local administration issues as they currently do. More serious foreign diplomatic discussions should be referred to the Archbishop of Sweden, who can then discuss with the Swedish Minister of Religion.

Conference concludes

With these matters now resolved the Archbishop of Sweden declared the conference concluded and thanked everyone for their input and consideration. The Archbishop has been honoured with the “Royal Order of the Seraphim", by the King of Sweden for his leadership at this conference and Swedish Lutheran Church.
 
5 IC

2 IC: Factory in Mongolia
2 IC: 2 Armies
1 IC: Culture

Colonize Siberia.


RP coming.
 
In Response to the Issue of Response to Response

The initial/response DoW system was set up to stop surprise attacks and give everyone who will be at war enough notice to plan a defence and gather allies. Unlike the original IB1 formulation I do not meant for the response period to favour defenders exclusively. I was careful to word my posts in the thread on the matter as something like "allies of wars' participants" rather than "allies of defenders" since the matter of attacker/defender can be ambiguous (what if someone declares war on another because they had tried to overthrow their government the previous turn? Or what if someone declares war to get back territory conquered by aggression in a previous war? Who's the aggressor or defender here?).

I'm going to standby this ruling:

In the "response DoW" period, you can declare war only on countries or alliances which are already at war. Countries with formal alliances with the participants of the wars (or defence pacts with the defenders) are obliged to honour their treaty obligations unless they have a really good reason.

Declaring war without a formal alliance or defence pact is possible but not encouraged, as it may lead to discontent among your populace, depending on how they feel about the countries you are supporting, the countries you are fighting against, and going to war in general.

Declaring war in support of an aggressor while citing a defensive pact may be seen as not having a proper casus belli, but the backlash will be more limited than if you don't have it at all. This depends on the situation and how the defence pact is worded though.

This sort of thing is one reason why I stressed (in the rules) that it is important to "specify the terms of the treaty/NAP/alliance". IIRC, no one has done so yet; everyone so far has only talked in rather vague terms of "alliances" and "defence pacts" without really clarifying the terms on which the alliance/pact partners can be called to war. Thus the system for dealing with this sort of conflict is already there, but no one's abiding by it.
 
Uh-huh. Well, I'll work on something for my alliances and traties now.
 
Papal Dispatch to the Kingdom of Bosnia

-

The Holy See in light of acts of blatant aggression from the Kingdom of Bosnia, and in consideration that the Kingdom is a neighbour of the papal temporal dominion. The Holy has the following requests for the Kingdom in order to establish clearly in the light of almighty God, that Bosnia has no ill-intent towards the Papal States.

-

: Bosnia withdraws for all time any territorial claim to Catholic Croatia and to the non-slavic realm of Albania,
: Bosnia recognises as the sole true religion, and as the official religion of state, the Divine and Catholic Faith its ancestors were forced to relinquish.
: Bosnia grants a donation of 2 IC to the Holy See as a sign of peaceful intent for the future.
: Bosnia officially apologises for the grave offence of its diplomat to our Secretary of State
: Bosnia forfeits all claim to the sovereign territory of Istanbul, as a token of peace.


-

Bosnian acquiescance to these requests would greatly put the mind of the curia at ease as to the intent of Bosnia in regards to the Papal States, and Catholic Europe at large.

~ The Nuncio to Bosnia.


---


Papal Dispatch to Mediterranea

-

The Aggression against the Second Empire of France is most disturbing to the Holy See in that it represents a violation of the sacred peace that exists between the Catholic nations of the world. The Holy See pleads with you for an immediate cease-fire between yourself and France in order to ensure diplomacy and christian virtue has a chance to amicably settle the issues between your two states. Please consider this proposal with utmost consideration, the Holy See cannot stand idly by when a state which calls itself Catholic attacks one of the same religion. Should this war continue the Holy See may be forced to take the appropriate ecclesiastical measures against you.

~ Nuncio to Mediterranea

---

~responses can go in my embassy page in the social group, I put them here since I wanted to make it more public :p
 
Khan Chiang:



Today Khan Chiang ordered the colonization of Siberia. Hundreds of Mongolians will move to colonize this cold land and make it part of the Mongol Empire. Houses and Military bases will be built in this land. Siberia belongs to the Mongols. And then the Great Khan will then send his Mongol Hordes to restore the Yuan Dynasty.

Imperial Palace, office of Khan Chiang

The Great Khan was sitting in his office and he was writing a letter to a girl he had met during his studies in Europe, just before his father died and he became Khan of Mongolia.

Dear Anna

I read your letter. I am very happy to see that you are doing very well in your new job. I, however, am not very well. Every day i spend 9 hours meting with advisor, ministers and senators. With Commanders and Generals.

But i have made a decision that could change the history of Mongolia. I have decided to colonize the cold lands of Siberia. Those new lands will bring wealth in Mongolia and will help me complete my plans to re-create the Yuan Dynasty.

Anyway i dont wish to write anymore about the politics of Mongolia. I want to inform you that in the Horse Races i came second. And just think that 20 princes, with the greatest horses in Mongolia, participated.

To end this letter, i want to inform you that while my body is in Mongolia, my heart is with you.

Love

Chiang.


Suddenly a guard entered the office of the Emperor. The guard shouted.

- Great Khan Chiang, The Minister of War, Mr. Gengis, wants to enter the office. Should i allow him to enter?!

- Of course! Now go and call him in.


Gengis, Minister of War:



Gengis enters the office and bows before Chiang.

- Great Khan Chiang!

- Yes Mr. Gengis....

- I want to inform you that our new armies are being trained in the arts of war. If all go well, the our armies shall be ready for the conquest of China.

- Has the army modern weaponry?

- Yes Sir!! We have weaponry from Napoleon's France. They (ooc: the weapons) came in Mongolia in 1812.

- Very well. Now please leave.

- Yes Sir!!


Gengis leaves the office and Chiang is now alone and can relax. He is thinking of placing a viceroy to help him. Once man cant run an entire Empire. But he then thinks of the great dangers. A viceroy could kill him and then claim the throne.

He then decided to stop thinking about the politics and relax. So he started reading a book, the Epic of Mongolia, a book that tells the story of a Mongolian warrior who, with a few warriors, managed to push back the Qing Dynasty from Mongolia and saved the Khanate.

Chapter 7: The Great Battle

The great warrior, Akinta Ganges, with his personal guard of 400 cavalry men managed to reach the desert of Destruction, an ancient place where the North Turkic Tribes and the Brave Mongols fought. There he saw the Qing army of 300,000 men. The Qing army had 100,000 cavalry men, 50,000 archers and 150,000 foot soldiers. However the desert and the lack of supplies had destroyed the morale of the Chinese army. Ganges saw the enemies from the top of mountain Xilanai, a mountain at the left side of the desert. He decided to set up traps for the enemies. When the Qing army marched near the mountain, suddenly huge rocks with fire fell from the mountain and hit them. They though that the Gods were punishing them and they started to run. Panic had wiped out the enemy. When the Qing started to retreat, the Mongol Hordes made a surprise attack and wiped out all of the enemy army. When the 70,000 Qing survivors re-grouped, they had to face both Ganges and Khan Kublai IV, who came in the desert with 40,000 men. The final battle begun.
 
This sort of thing is one reason why I stressed (in the rules) that it is important to "specify the terms of the treaty/NAP/alliance". IIRC, no one has done so yet; everyone so far has only talked in rather vague terms of "alliances" and "defence pacts" without really clarifying the terms on which the alliance/pact partners can be called to war. Thus the system for dealing with this sort of conflict is already there, but no one's abiding by it.

Satisfied?
 
Unspecified treaties seems a lot better, it means you can make stuff up when you need to!
 
Papal Dispatch to the Kingdom of Bosnia

-

The Holy See in light of acts of blatant aggression from the Kingdom of Bosnia, and in consideration that the Kingdom is a neighbour of the papal temporal dominion. The Holy has the following requests for the Kingdom in order to establish clearly in the light of almighty God, that Bosnia has no ill-intent towards the Papal States.

-

: Bosnia withdraws for all time any territorial claim to Catholic Croatia and to the non-slavic realm of Albania,
: Bosnia recognises as the sole true religion, and as the official religion of state, the Divine and Catholic Faith its ancestors were forced to relinquish.
: Bosnia grants a donation of 2 IC to the Holy See as a sign of peaceful intent for the future.
: Bosnia officially apologises for the grave offence of its diplomat to our Secretary of State
: Bosnia forfeits all claim to the sovereign territory of Istanbul, as a token of peace.

1) lol no, I have a bigger claim then you do, and Albania is not Catholic its Muslim
2) Bosnias religion is Islam
3) Do you want a musical with that
4) Maybe Cats?
5) What is this?

Short answer THIS IS ABSURD!
 
The war is at least 20% more absurd.
 

The Pan-Indian Prosperity Initiative Treaty

An organisation of nations interested in preserving Indian Sovereignty operating currently by 5 of a 6 point plan.

-Mutual defense pact (If one nation declares war on a nation within Pipit then all Pipit nations may declare war on the aggressor)
-Non aggression treaty
-Unified sphere of influence over the Indian sub-continent
-Military alliance should the sovereignty of Indian soil be threatened (Can be an offensive alliance.)
-Creation of a council of nations interested in preserving Indian independence
 
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