Trump's statements and promises

[AppleDumplingHead]

So the Russians are the problem? Lol:

There are plenty of people who think the things he talks about are unreasonable and infractions on "their" definitions of "freedom". It's not a cliche to say "freedom isn't free", and it doesn't mean "freedom from embarrassment" or "freedom from impunity".

Someone might say to me, "If you write a love poem in an email to some random you met at a bar, would you want some group of people at the NSA reading that and laughing at you". Well, if I had a problem being laughed at, I wouldn't have written it in the first place, under the knowledge she might share it. What about medical records, employment records, criminal data? Those are passed between so many people, it's not reasonable to believe they're ultimately somehow private in the first place.

Freedom is important, but we need to be practical and realistic. If one wants to be private, one simply doesn't participate on the grid at all. It's not the government about which one generally needs to worry, the government has nothing against you personally. One needs to be wary of the people with axes to grind, or just endeavor to not have people with axes to grind against oneself.

On a final note, if you think Russia, China, KSA, whomever, don't do everything this guy is describing, you're fooling only yourself. The difference is what they do with the data. China will (on record) come get you if you say the wrong thing. There's a very good chance to disappear this way. Russia, I'm not so sure, I hear of it happening but only in very extreme circumstances. In the USA, you have to be screwing up pretty darn bad, and not just be some wingnut, for them to come after you. Putin's probably sitting listening, taking notes, from this guy, figuring how he can better control dissent, so he can remain in power another 20 years.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

There are plenty of people who think the things he talks about are unreasonable and infractions on "their" definitions of "freedom". It's not a cliche to say "freedom isn't free", and it doesn't mean "freedom from embarrassment" or "freedom from impunity".

Someone might say to me, "If you write a love poem in an email to some random you met at a bar, would you want some group of people at the NSA reading that and laughing at you". Well, if I had a problem being laughed at, I wouldn't have written it in the first place, under the knowledge she might share it. What about medical records, employment records, criminal data? Those are passed between so many people, it's not reasonable to believe they're ultimately somehow private in the first place.

Freedom is important, but we need to be practical and realistic. If one wants to be private, one simply doesn't participate on the grid at all. It's not the government about which one generally needs to worry, the government has nothing against you personally. One needs to be wary of the people with axes to grind, or just endeavor to not have people with axes to grind against oneself.

On a final note, if you think Russia, China, KSA, whomever, don't do everything this guy is describing, you're fooling only yourself. The difference is what they do with the data. China will (on record) come get you if you say the wrong thing. There's a very good chance to disappear this way. Russia, I'm not so sure, I hear of it happening but only in very extreme circumstances. In the USA, you have to be screwing up pretty darn bad, and not just be some wingnut, for them to come after you. Putin's probably sitting listening, taking notes, from this guy, figuring how he can better control dissent, so he can remain in power another 20 years.

In regard to the US I have lost my illusions sometime ago as for the other two you are I think right. But never the less people do disapear in the US if you cross the ways of the shadow government its not some kind of eastern speciality. There has been good number of US cases I have came across lately. Whats more troubling is the general trend towards totalitarism:

In the future the fight isnt going to be the US vs. Russia but the freedom lovers and true progressives vs. the enslavers of mankind and their helpers.

 

[AppleDumplingHead]

We have enough brain drain right now without some shadow government agency making luminaries disappear. Crazy people who think they're luminaries disappear into hospitals. Criminal people who think they're luminaries disappear into prisons. They're well cared for and with appropriate permissions, you can visit or correspond with all of them.

A real luminary realizes there are practical limits. A real luminary realizes there must be order and sometimes that order comes with unfortunate circumstance, as corruption. A real luminary brings something to the world, not only complains how things are so messed up, but provides better answers for everyone involved.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

We have enough brain drain right now without some shadow government agency making luminaries disappear. Crazy people who think they're luminaries disappear into hospitals. Criminal people who think they're luminaries disappear into prisons. They're well cared for and with appropriate permissions, you can visit or correspond with all of them.

A real luminary realizes there are practical limits. A real luminary realizes there must be order and sometimes that order comes with unfortunate circumstance, as corruption. A real luminary brings something to the world, not only complains how things are so messed up, but provides better answers for everyone involved.

Your belief ignores reality and doesnt have a rational core. You cant shed light on anything if you are afraid to face the facts.

Just for amusements of all the "real luminary" folks out there:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kalevle...ssian-hacking-of-the-power-grid/#2b2af849291e

 

[AppleDumplingHead]

Your belief ignores reality and doesnt have a rational core. You can shed light on anything if you are afraid to face the facts.

Ok, I will play along. Name an American luminary who has disappeared.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

Ok, I will play along. Name an American luminary who has disappeared.

Forget about "luminaries". The problem its that the people who present noncomformist information and facts that they disapear/mysteriously die: journalist and others. I can compile a list of recent deaths when I have the time for it.

 

[AppleDumplingHead]

Forget about "luminaries". The problem its that the people who present noncomformist information and facts that they disapear/mysteriously die: journalist and others. I can compile a list of recent deaths when I have the time for it.

If you're going to reach into the void of fringe lunatics, I can add my own conspiracy theory that "non-conformists" are funded or otherwise supported by foreign governments, solely for the purpose of inciting chaos and falsely portrayed data. It's fortunate we have people trying to bring an end to this. A couple crazy people can be ignored by and large, crazy people being fed ammunition and disseminating propaganda expressly for the purpose of harm are more convincing. That's not freedom anymore by any definition, that is manipulation.

You, for example, cite all this RT and russphile propaganda, you've bought into that disseminated harmful portrayal. They are supported by foreign governments, expressly for the purpose of confusing and then convincing malleable minds to their agenda. So you buy into it, you spread it more. That's a harmful circle. You're participating in a harmful act toward the USA. In a way you know it, you relish in it, yet you're genuine because you're so convinced this skewed perception is real, and that's unfortunate.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

If you're going to reach into the void of fringe lunatics, I can add my own conspiracy theory that "non-conformists" are funded or otherwise supported by foreign governments, solely for the purpose of inciting chaos and falsely portrayed data. It's fortunate we have people trying to bring an end to this. A couple crazy people can be ignored by and large, crazy people being fed ammunition and disseminating propaganda expressly for the purpose of harm are more convincing. That's not freedom anymore by any definition, that is manipulation.

You forget that the truth has to be fought for by exposing lies not by killing those who present different view or are questioning the official truth. The moment you accept any shorcut you surrender both your truth and freedom.

 

[AppleDumplingHead]

You forget that the truth has to be fought for by exposing lies not by killing those who present different view or questioning the official truth. The moment you accept any shorcut you dont deserve either truth or freedom.

You can fight for all kinds of things, but your truth isn't always the truth. My truth is from experience in the school of hard knocks, from living every day, immersed in the trenches for decades. When I read media, I can generally tell right away what is bottom line truth, what is embellished, what is nonsense. Not everyone has my practical level of experience with life, suffering, struggle and success. Many people are numb, in shades of gray, living daily lives very insulated and ignorant of the real situations and consequences of human life, and sometimes, if put in just the right way, it's very easy to make them believe things which are not only untrue, but wholly impossible.

For example, what level of rationale is necessary to indicate some child trafficking ring isn't being run from the basement of a pizza restaurant. How very sensible must one be to realize this story is misleading fiction? Yet many people believed it. Can you point at every believer of that and say "you're an idiot"? Well, no, many might be very capable of, for example, higher level math, but they're very unwise to what's practical and real. These are the people that false media hopes to convince, these are the people that people like you would very much like to reach, and that's unfortunate.

Sometimes I read people say "the other side isn't portrayed", but what if the other side is fabricated, spun, intentional convoluting in the mere interest in creating confusion and dissent? That's a problem. That's not "the other side" if it's bs, and by bs I think you know what I mean.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

You can fight for all kinds of things, but your truth isn't always the truth. My truth is from experience in the school of hard knocks, from living every day, immersed in the trenches for decades. When I read media, I can generally tell right away what is bottom line truth, what is embellished, what is nonsense. Not everyone has my practical level of experience with life, suffering, struggle and success. Many people are numb, in shades of gray, living daily lives very insulated and ignorant of the real situations and consequences of human life, and sometimes, if put in just the right way, it's very easy to make them believe things which are not only untrue, but wholly impossible.

This is generally speaking true except the last part since nothing is impossible. Even if you had thousand years of practical life experience to declare something impossible is very bold statment and showes rather the close-minded approach. Its the other way around actually: everything is possible under its own proper time and circumstances but I guess you know that too (at least intuitively) from your life experience.

For example, what level of rationale is necessary to indicate some child trafficking ring isn't being run from the basement of a pizza restaurant. How very sensible must one be to realize this story is misleading fiction? Yet many people believed it. Can you point at every believer of that and say "you're an idiot"? Well, no, many might be very capable of, for example, higher level math, but they're very unwise to what's practical and real. These are the people that false media hopes to convince, these are the people that people like you would very much like to reach, and that's unfortunate.

See the problem here is that no one actually makes the same claim you do. I have looked into the matter and find out that the circumstantial evidence is there. Is it a set up? May be but the problem isnt the people who follow this evidence but the people who try to cover up the truth. If you resign on that in the name of some larger harmony I can see your point but I dont wholy agree.

 

[AppleDumplingHead]

This is generally speaking true except the last part since nothing is impossible. Even if you had thousand years of practical life experience to declare something impossible is very bold statment and showes rather the close-minded approach. Its the other way around actually: everything is possible under its own proper circumstances but I guess you know that too (at least intuitively) from your life experience.


See the problem here is that no one actually makes the same claim you do. I have look into the matter and find out that the circumstantial evidence is there. Is it a set up? May be but the problem isnt the people who follow this evidence but the people who try to cover up the truth. If you resign on that in the name of some larger harmony I can see your point but I dont wholy agree.

You know, man, here's the thing. I see alot of what you have to say argues for the betterment of the west's perception of Russia. I argue a little on that front, with elk, too, but see, there's a big difference here between what you do and what elk does. You don't stop at propagandizing Russia, you go further, so far into the fringe ill-perception of the USA. It's one thing to want to bring Russia up, and I'll absolutely agree Russia has a storied history of a strong and noble (albeit victimized) populace who, for the most part, don't deserve a bad wrap, and I'll even bring up empathy for tragedies that befall Russia and the people, like a massive hit to culture which happened in the Russian plane crash.

Your effort doesn't stop at "bringing Russia up". You carry on to conspiracy theories and nonsense with the obvious impact of bringing America down. I'm not even sure you have any real interest in helping Russia at all, when your portrayal of all of this seems to be "so what, America is worse". I just don't believe in your agenda, man. I don't think it's pure, I don't think it's right, I don't believe you have the intention to help anyone, I don't believe you care to fix the things to which you point. It's readily apparent, by USA success and aid for billions (literally billions) across the globe that, while the USA has a few issues which need resolved, we're a hell of a lot closer to real, better answers than what you seem to very much like to display. I don't believe you really are presenting "both sides". I just don't believe in your presentation at all, and I think others, likewise, should not.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

You know, man, here's the thing. I see alot of what you have to say argues for the betterment of the west's perception of Russia. I argue a little on that front, with elk, too, but see, there's a big difference here between what you do and what elk does. You don't stop at propagandizing Russia, you go further, so far into the fringe ill-perception of the USA. It's one thing to want to bring Russia up, and I'll absolutely agree Russia has a storied history of a strong and noble (albeit victimized) populace who, for the most part, don't deserve a bad wrap, and I'll even bring up empathy for tragedies that befall Russia and the people, like a massive hit to culture which happened in the Russian plane crash.

Your effort doesn't stop at "bringing Russia up". You carry on to conspiracy theories and nonsense with the obvious impact of bringing America down. I'm not even sure you have any real interest in helping Russia at all, when your portrayal of all of this seems to be "so what, America is worse". I just don't believe in your agenda, man. I don't think it's pure, I don't think it's right, I don't believe you have the intention to help anyone, I don't believe you care to fix the things to which you point. It's readily apparent, by USA success and aid for billions (literally billions) across the globe that, while the USA has a few issues which need resolved, we're a hell of a lot closer to real, better answers than what you seem to very much like to display. I don't believe you really are presenting "both sides". I just don't believe in your presentation at all, and I think others, likewise, should not.

The thing is often you have to first destroy before you can create anew. I can see the destruction/change is coming and instead just waiting for it I try to destroy/rebuild first so that when the real hit comes it doesnt destroy with the full force.

 

[uppi]

There are plenty of people who think the things he talks about are unreasonable and infractions on "their" definitions of "freedom". It's not a cliche to say "freedom isn't free", and it doesn't mean "freedom from embarrassment" or "freedom from impunity".

Someone might say to me, "If you write a love poem in an email to some random you met at a bar, would you want some group of people at the NSA reading that and laughing at you". Well, if I had a problem being laughed at, I wouldn't have written it in the first place, under the knowledge she might share it. What about medical records, employment records, criminal data? Those are passed between so many people, it's not reasonable to believe they're ultimately somehow private in the first place.

Freedom is important, but we need to be practical and realistic. If one wants to be private, one simply doesn't participate on the grid at all. It's not the government about which one generally needs to worry, the government has nothing against you personally. One needs to be wary of the people with axes to grind, or just endeavor to not have people with axes to grind against oneself.

On a final note, if you think Russia, China, KSA, whomever, don't do everything this guy is describing, you're fooling only yourself. The difference is what they do with the data. China will (on record) come get you if you say the wrong thing. There's a very good chance to disappear this way. Russia, I'm not so sure, I hear of it happening but only in very extreme circumstances. In the USA, you have to be screwing up pretty darn bad, and not just be some wingnut, for them to come after you. Putin's probably sitting listening, taking notes, from this guy, figuring how he can better control dissent, so he can remain in power another 20 years.

This is an extremely short-sighted attitude. You might not have to worry about the government right now, but can you say the same thing after the next election? In 20 years? You cannot actually know whether the data is used to suppress dissidents or not, because everything is secret and the US government has made people disappear in the past.

Your data might not be very private right now, but first of all that is something you should aim to change and not shrug your shoulders if additional people are going to see it. Because sooner or later it will get in the hands of someone who has an ax to grind with you (or just smells profit) and by giving your data to everyone, you increase the chances of that happening.

Second, data becomes more powerful, the more you get. Random people having some data on you is not as dangerous as all your data stored in one place. Someone having access to you whole medical data is bad, but if he also knows who your boss is and that your boss would fire you if he knew of your health is much worse.

Freedom of speech also contains the freedom to choose who to speak to. There are things that you only want to share with people you trust. If the government takes away that ability and you cannot share information without sharing it with people you cannot trust, you freedom is substantially reduced.

 

[Kyriakos]

The Trump twitter thing has to stop, cause it is making the whole US look worse, imo.

 

[aelf]

I don't know why everyone has such a hard time figuring out what Trump will do. His personality has been obvious for months before the election because he makes no effort to hold back anything. He is a lying, manipulative SOB who ran for president for ego. The only thing consistent about him is that he will do in his presidency whatever is best for himself, to enrich himself and to increase his power by whatever means are possible. All the promises he makes on behalf of others are just for show, and he has already broken many of them before even entering office. Also, it's quite obvious that he's a lackey of Putin, whether because of personal admiration or because he is himself manipulated by him. That's what you can expect from the next 4 years -- legislation that enriches Trump, increases his power, either as president, or personally. You can expect any shady dealings that increase his wealth and power. You can expect him to turn a blind eye to any Russian transgressions, and if we're lucky, he won't defecate on the Constitution before he's out of office. He's got Congress eating out of his tiny hands (majority Republican) he's got a vacancy on the SC that he can fill with his man, making it majority Republican, and he's got a fan base that eats out of his tiny hands too. This is better than a tyrant's wet dream.

I think you're right. But I do wonder what kind of concrete developments might happen under his watch. Is he likely to blunder into a war? Is he likely to be obviously implicated in some conflict of interest or shady dealings, with resulting attempts by the Dems to impeach him only to be blocked by the Republicans?

 

[Neonanocyborgasm]

I think you're right. But I do wonder what kind of concrete developments might happen under his watch. Is he likely to blunder into a war? Is he likely to be obviously implicated in some conflict of interest or shady dealings, with resulting attempts by the Dems to impeach him only to be blocked by the Republicans?

He's already implicated in shady dealings and conflicts of interest. He's already blundering into wars (whether cold or hot). And he's doing all this before inauguration. If he can manage that so quickly, the next four years are going to be a wild ride. American influence, wealth, and power, both domestically and internationally is going to take a nosedive. The economy will be handicapped because he'll hoard all of it to himself, or in the guise of tax cuts for the wealthy. Civil rights may be impaired because he won't like anyone criticizing him and will try to silence them legally or extra-legally. International relations will suffer because no one will take him seriously. Already the Chinese are laughing at him, and they're doing it publicly. They're not even trying to hide their contempt. All this will play into Russia's hands. While the US is imploding, they'll be asserting their power unimpeded. Even if the public wises up in 4 years, Russia will have had a great head start.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

^^^ I dont know what news source you are tuned to but they sure seem to have lot of fables on their program.

 

[Neonanocyborgasm]

^^^ I dont know what news source you are tuned to but they sure seem to have lot of fables on their program.

Same as you -- RT.

 

[Mechanicalsalvation]

Same as you -- RT.

Are you sure itsnt the Washington compost?

 

[Neonanocyborgasm]

Уверен.