Born of Fire: Discussion and Development Thread

[Supa]

The solution

What I had not considered before was that both of these important features could be fully represented using the enslave function. I have taken inspiration from scenarios such as The Rood and the Dragon and Escape From Zombie Island which have, if I remember correctly, both made innovate use of the enslave function. My current plan is as follows:

• All civs will only* be able to build peasant/common (level 1) soldiers directly.
• Each type (e.g. atlatl, spear) of level one soldier will have the enslave ability, with the 'enslave results in' option set to the level 2 soldier (higher-ranking/noble) of the same type.
• In some cases, the level 2 soldier will be able to 'promote to' (enslave) a level 3 soldier (possibly elite troops of some sort).

In consequence, the two features listed above can (if I am correct) be represented, making for more historically accurate, and just as importantly, unique gameplay.

• Peasant/common troops should make up the bulk of most armies (particularly of those civs who have engaged in little combat), while higher-ranking/noble/elite troops will be comparatively less common (though their numbers may grow in reflection of success in warfare.)
• Individual units which have been successful in combat will be able to 'promote to' (that is, enslave) units of higher rank, without having to resort to the regular combat experience or unit upgrade systems.

Simple yet elegant. I like it a lot!

 

[AnthonyBoscia]

Great to see you back in action, RedAlert. Like Supa said, your plan sounds very good. I like how it rewards the teams that take risks, essentially in contrast to autoproduction which rewards builders.

 

[Virote_Considon]

Definitely a great idea, and nice seeing you, too!

In a couple of my mods I've used enslavement lines to allow access to otherwise unbuildable units. Useful, for example, in allowing the AI access to hidden nationality units which they like to build in excess if you allow them to build it manually.

 

[Ogedei_the_Mad]

The Legend has returned.

 

[Blue Monkey]

Good to hear from you again.

Better to get things right than quickly. You're not alone in having a project that is taking a long time to work out. One advantage is the discussions like this one. We all learn something from it.

Have to go back and reread your post a few times to "squeeze the orange". So may have missed some of these ideas on first reading of it. An additional technique for elite warriors (learned this from Balthasar) is static units that can upgrade to powerful or one-of-a-kind when a certain technology or resource appears. If the static units are in the capital but the needed resource is rare and far away then there is incentive to both protect the territory & trade roads and also to expand. Also, if there is an incentive to throw the earlier units into combat then that will keep the upgrades rare. Maybe there is a way to use the GL flag as well? Having more than one promotion technique could be another way to distinguish civs.

 

[Balthasar]

I'm fascinated by your tech tree. Did you ever come up with a tree for era 4?

 

[The Guardian]

I love your ideas regarding the unit promotion plans you outlined. I am thinking of using your ideas in my SPQR MOD. Many of the civs during the Roman era made extensive use of mercenaries. I can see a way of using your enslavement ideas for creating these mercenaries. I can also use it to promote legios to tribunes to centurions to legates to praetors to consuls, instead of having them auto-produced.

Great idea Red. I like it alot.

 

[Vuldacon]

I have not had much time lately so I am rather late but Welcome Back Red Alert.

From reading your recent posts, it seems you are getting things for your game right with added editing techniques that will add many nice touches to it.

I wish you the best of luck with your game and because that really means "Laboring Under Correct Knowledge", I am certain you will be "Lucky"

EDIT: I wanted to mention to you that I use the techniques in EFZI2 Complete that you are considering for your game. Having Units Enslave different Units of which many cannot be built.
The AI is the Big Problem concerning having enough game control over what you want them to build or do... I find that Auto-Production provides control of the AI especially if the Units that are Auto-Produced cannot be built and that leaves the Other Units that can be built to the AI. That and Enslavement by Special Units with Upgrades offers enough control of the AI to allow game management that can offer Special Events and Historical Accuracy as you want the game to play.

Another Factor is the AI not tending to Build a Wonder when at War. The AI will Build any Wonder or Improvement when the Game starts even if they are at War so keep in mind that you can have the Early Wonders that the AI will Build, pre-place Improvements that will become "activated" later as you see fit. This is controlled by Resources that appear when a Particular Tech is gained.
Concerning this... keep in mind that even if an Improvement only auto-produces a Unit every 14 turns for example, IF the early Wonder places the Improvements early and 14 turns have gone by when the Improvement is activated, the improvements will produce the Unit the same turn the tech with resource is gained then continue every 14 turns.
It is also best to allow the "Improvements" to be built in case the City with the Wonder is Captured... and if the City is a Pre-placed City that Builds the Wonder, by all means make it Strong
You not only control the AI but direct the Human Player through the Game Play experience you intend.

 

[Vladi]

And, what happened with this Mesoamerican Mod, where can I it download?